The_KC_Godfather

Missouri - J'Den Cox (more NCAA titles and world gold's, Olympic bronze) or Sammie Henson (only in the convo because of Olympic silver).

I’m glad you specified the quote. At first I was concerned you were talking about “skids”

I'm sure people on an internet message board would play a big factor in his choice to coach a college team I can't see him leaving his current situation either. Not worth the stress.

Man, that's a great haircut... In all seriousness, I was glad to hear him say "wrestling is a privilege" at the end of that interview. Hope he keeps that mindset.

Fixed.

Thanks for that. I would imagine the opportunity to wrestle for Cael would out weight NIL money anyway for a lot of wrestlers that want to be in the sport long term.

That's the million dollar question. Perfect fit...

I’m wondering if he didn’t think he’d have long term success, so might as well go to school for free and be in the sun (he mentioned something about nice weather). Then, perhaps, Ben did Ben things by helping him with the mental and convincing him he could go far if he changed his mindset. And, of course, there’s the opportunity to wrestle for Cael. And NIL money.

Or he’s just tired of seeing someone who is trying to stir up drama when others would like to just discuss the topic…

So, the Chiefs didn’t want to turn it on in their 6 losses? Just wanted to make it exciting, so they chose to turn it on at the last minute to get the 3 seed? Why not turn it on earlier to get the 1 seed? Champions can do that, right? They made mistakes early and that’s why they lost. They weren’t disciplined. I just showed the comparison. You can ignore it if you want. You do you.

Titles has nothing to do with his comparison. The Chiefs were sluggish and didn’t look like themselves until they got to the playoffs (that they nearly missed). Then they turned it on. Mizzou looks sluggish and not like themselves, so hopefully they turn it on before the playoffs (Conf and Natty). Seems like a solid comparison/wish to me…

Looking forward to 174 and 184 especially. Is Rocky gonna go at 97?

I mean…think about the education you get at Cornell. A lot of companies are going to look highly on that, not to mention the career options. Seems like a no brainer to me…

Have to ask…how do you imbed the YouTube videos like that?

I just read that they settled a class action lawsuit in November over this

Great topic. Does Ben have the name recognition? Of course. Nine out of ten elite wrestlers that are worth recruiting have gone to many LL and HS tournaments and I’m sure have seen AWA or at minimum know who he is through watching Keegan and other AWA alum. As great as Ben is, he’s never run a college program. He’s never had to manage scheduling, boosters, alumni events, administration, NCAA relationship, etc. At least people like Dake, Taylor, Burroughs stayed around college wrestling and I’m sure have or will learn the intricacies of the head coach responsibilities. Ben hasn’t been in a college program in how long now. Running a business and teaching technique is different than running a college athletic program. That said, he’d have to be an assistant initially to learn the ropes. The only people I think he’d respect enough to do that with is Brian Smith and maybe Alex Clemson with the caveat that he takes over within a few years. The only reason I could see him taking a college job is if his competitive side wants to see if he can beat Cael. Otherwise, why leave a job where you’re your own boss, are comfortable financially (remember he’s sitting on millions from MMA and Jake Paul), and can work as much or as little as you want? I can’t see him doing that unless it’s to be the best and beat the best. My guess on the Flo comments is actually the reverse of what most have said. I think Flo said “we’re paying this guy 6 figures for very little…time to cut costs”. I’d think they asked him to not indicate that and that’s why he said what he did.

Such a great post. I also believe Max said after his NCAA title that he was struggling mentally before the final, but Ben came down and talked to him and got his mind right. Same thing with Keegan if you watch Funky 2.0 on Flo.

I thought I figured out how to imbed a video instead of posting just the link, and failed. Wouldn’t let me delete the post so went with the dot until I figured it out…

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I don't know that I agree with this. If you had the likes of Gwiz, Gable, Snyder...would you not fill an assistant position with them? I know they are exceptions to the rule because of their success, but generally saying a former HWT. shouldn't be an assistance isn't completely accurate. I think it depends more on their focus. The perfect scenario is a head coach that manages the big picture (media, recruiting, boosters, AD, etc.) and then has technicians that run the day-to-day. I agree that a HWT. isn't the best case for leading that day-to-day because they are limited on "small guy" technique, but they certainly can be helpful to your upper weights. Depending on the size of the staff, an Assoc. Head Coach that runs day to day, and depending on their strength (ie. lower weights or middle weights), you have an assistant that balances that with the opposite (lower or middle weights). A hwt. coach as your last would be ideal. If I were putting together the perfect staff for Tom as the head coach, it would be Burroughs as the Assoc. Head Coach (middle weights), Sammie Henson or Terry Brands as an assistant (light weights and motivation) and Gwiz. as an assistant (heavy's). Then have Terry and Burroughs run HWC (Jordan for recruiting, Terry for training). I personally would love to see Mizzou bring back Sammie as a lightweight coach, with Maple as the Assoc. Head at middleweight and Dom Bradley as the HWT assistant. But I don't think Sammie is leaving Bull Trained without a big chunk of money thrown at him.

For all of his posts quoting scripture, he may want to look into some bible verses about humility...

Agree with all of your thoughts. I was of the thought process a while back that there should be a replacement for the Brands', but I do think that Tom brings a lot of value as the top guy (recruiting, relationships, management of scholarships, boosters, etc.). And he does have a top 5 finish every season in the last 15. I think the calls for his head are just because they (and the Iowa faithful) expect to win a title every year, but he's still one of the top coaches in the country. I don't know how much pull or influence Terry has, but he reminds me of a Sammie Henson. As much as I love and respect Sammie, he's a grinder and not a head coach. A great #2 (look at what he did at Mizzou and other places), but the head job is a LOT more than just teaching technique and hyping guys up. On possible guys coming in, my thought process was the same as yours...I looked at guys who might be getting close to retiring from the senior level, or may realize they won't make a team behind the likes of Dake or DT. Guys that I saw/thought of in those categories were Zane Richards, Joey McKenna, Chance Marsteller (seems he's turned things around, but not sure he has the chops to be a #2), Burroughs (I've heard he won't leave Nebraska), Mark Hall (would he leave PSU and/or would Iowa have him?), Ringer, Kollin Moore, Gwiz. What would be REALLY crazy is if Gable Steveson doesn't pan out in WWE and gets a big NIL deal from Iowa, but I doubt he'd go anywhere but Minny. To really change culture, I think you'd almost have to have someone mature like Burroughs. Fun topic, but Iowa (aside from Tom and D. Gable) may be happy with current results, filling seats, etc. The higher ups may not think there's any reason to change, so it's just a "if you want to be a part of Iowa wrestling, expect to be beat up year around for 4 years".

Who do you think are some options that could come in and make an impact? Someone mentioned Yianni which I think would be great from a technical perspective. But as I think through who would be a good fit, I almost think it has to be someone who won’t get sucked into the “Iowa against the world” attitude. They have to change the cult like mindset that Metcalf and others have talked about (someone said Zalesky tried to imitate Gable when speaking to his team?). To me, Iowa style is the hard nosed, in your face, shoot 100 times in 7 minutes. It’s not intentionally running into someone at a bar because they left Iowa and grew out of that mindset. Gilman is probably an exception because he’s a little nutty anyway, but seems like the attitude is pushed into the DNA when you come to Iowa City. I would also fear that the Brands’ wouldn’t be amenable to changing unless some higher ups pushed it on them. I don’t know if John Smith is truly contemplating retirement and decided it was good to bring in Coleman, or if someone above him said “hey we need to change things” and pushed it on him.

This. Hard nosed grinding isn't enough anymore with the evolvement of the sport. Do I think that TnT are absolutely capable of evolving with it? Yes. Do I think that they're too stubborn and think the Gable way of hard nosed grinding is still enough? Yes. This is EXACTLY the same thing with John Smith, imo. Bring in Coleman to get the program into the 21st century and adapt/evolve, and things take a turn for the better very quickly. Also brings a different mentality, not of a drill sergeant. As much as TnT and John like to think these athletes are "kids", they aren't...they're adults, and a lot of adults don't want to be screamed at or beat up constantly. Agree with whoever said they need to bring in some new blood (eg. Yianni). You can still keep Iowa Style, but again, it needs to evolve. NIL money can work wonders to bring in some top tier talent. As it relates to my other thread about "is it a mistake to transfer to Iowa", I think the convo there applies here as well. The grind that TnT and the old school/existing Iowa Style puts on guys is a lot. Transfers coming in from other conferences aren't used to the Iowa Style grind and a B1G schedule, and I'm sure it wears their bodies out. Cael has figured out a way to have his wrestlers in top physical condition and always performing at a high level without them thinking they're in the military. Sure, there are injuries, but nothing (especially long term a la Spencer) that isn't part of college wrestling. Iowa is still a premier program and anybody would be lucky to go there, but there is always room for improvement, especially when you're expecting to be the best every year.

Great thoughts. This is the same interesting conversation where I never know which way to go on the Mahomes vs. Brady GOAT debate. When do you actually call someone the GOAT? Is Brady the GOAT until Mahomes retires? Does Mahomes have to play until he's 45 so their stats are apples to apples comparable? Can Mahomes be considered the GOAT now because he's achieved more than Brady did in his first x number of seasons? Depending on which category you're talking about, it can be apples to oranges. That's where it's tough to consider on these coaches too. Can Cael not be considered the GOAT until he has as many team natty's or individual natty's as the other guys? Will Cael finish in the top 3 in 25 straight years, and that therefore puts him higher than Nichols because he only finished top 4 in 27 years? Always an interesting discussion and I don't ever know how to lock down one way or the other.