VakAttack

Yup. Just deeply obtuse. Mind-numbing.

The concern on behalf of the Democratic party from you all is very touching and I'm sure comes from an honest place.

That's not...holy shit, it seems impossible to be this obtuse, but here you are. His lawyers are arguing he would be immune if he did. He endorsed that idea himself above, and has literally previously made statements about shooting people. That's literally the whole point of this thread. This is who he is, and he truly believes he is above the law. He outright says it.

....If he ordered someone murdered, that is a violent crime.

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-appeals-hearing-lawyer-argues-president-rival-assassinated-congress-2024-1 https://www.vice.com/en/article/xgwkj4/trump-lawyer-says-assassinating-rivals-might-not-be-a-prosecutable-crime Are you trying to have a semantics debate about the requirement of impeachment prior to prosecution? Or are you trying to say he didn't argue it? As to the judge asking extreme hypothetical questions, that's every judge ever in this situation, including every single Justice on SCOTUS, both left and right. That's part of the job to tease out argument about how the law would be applied under lawyer arguments in the most extreme cases. The lawyer was arguing before that that Trump couldn't be prosecuted for crimes alleged to have committed in office because he hadn't been impeached, so the logical extreme example from that argument is what if he ordered someone murdered. The judges also pointed out the de facto full immunity you're giving any president for anything they do in office because they could just resign prior to any impeachment hearing. The idea that POTUS should be immune from any criminal prosecution would be "chilling on their ability to lead" is bull crap, political leaders all across the world have been subjected to prosecution for decades, and the idea that POTUS should get special treatment is ridiculous. Their should be SOME immunity for things in the actual course of his job, but not for actual crimes committed

In what way is it a misrepresentation.

Not sure what you're referencing here. Something related to his drone strike travesties?

This has been known for awhile. The Ds switched their calendar (likely as political payback for Jim Clyburn being a key endorsement for Biden, but publicly the claim has been that SC is more representative of their diverse coalition). New Hampshire said "eff you" and held their primary anyway, which is in line with the independent streak of New Hampshire that both parties deal with.

There is no legitimate case for Dake, IMO. Cael won four, undefeated, bonus throughout. Cael did everything we would ask to be considered the greatest.

The bold is just false. And you literally went to name-calling in the next sentence!

Disagreeing with somebody is not condescending. However, I freely admit there are some people on here that I have condescended to on this thread (and who have condescended to me). However, it seems like you and Mr. Dimon are only focusing on one side that needs to show respect to the other, and THAT has been my point from the beginning of my entry into this thread. Democrats and Biden are called to task for even the mildest criticism or disrespect, whereas Trump and Republicans are allowed to make among the most despicable accusations one can make with no proof and it's all handwaved away. As to Biden breaking with his party, here's a quick smattering of the oil links and the last one touches on multiple breaks with party. https://biologicaldiversity.org/w/news/press-releases/biden-administration-oil-gas-drilling-approvals-outpace-trumps-2023-01-24/ https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/29/politics/biden-offshore-drilling-plan-climate/index.html https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-broke-central-campaign-promise-progressives-not-happy https://thehill.com/homenews/4366339-biden-takes-hits-from-democrats-on-multiple-fronts/

Then you're not paying attention. https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/15/politics/donald-trump-biden-retweet/index.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/16/us/donald-trump-jr-biden-smear.html https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QAnon I'm sorry you feel that way. I feel that, in general, our exchanges have been cordial; however I would love to for you to point out a place where I've been irrational. And Biden IS doing all that. In the real world. Getting things passed that are bipartisan support, despite the efforts of certain aspects of conservative political sphere trying hard to undermine that, and doing things counter to what the more progressive wings of his party want, such as how he's handling the Israel-Palestine conflict or his administrations actions re: drilling for oil.

Good point. So your argument is that Biden should treat the people who call him either a child-eating pedophile or dementia-ridden puppet with the utmost respect? Because he personally draws a distinction between all Republicans and the MAGA movement. Or that Democrats in general should treat with respect the people who call them child-groomers intent on destroying the country? Why is this not a mutual requirement? Because that's what we're talking about here. Not the people who are able to converse respectfully with one another. As mentioned previously, I consider @Husker_Du a personal friend and he and I differ greatly on politics. Lots of my family members are on the conservative end of the spectrum, most of them are able to discuss things respectfully. That kind of conversation happens all over the country every day. If Dimon is talking about every progressive talking to every conservative, he's arguing against a straw man.

Combined with a Trump attorney arguing on his behalf that Trump should be immune even if he ordered the assassination of a political rival, things are going....really great. Maybe Jamie Dimon can weigh in again about how the Democrats are the problem?

A little over. The max is 717.5 years.

You have no idea what you're talking about or what i, a criminal defense lawyer, think about incarceration. I actually do not believe Trump should Trump should be incarcerated if he's convicted in either the documents case or the hush money case. If convicted in either of the election interference cases, I'm more open to the idea because those caused real damage to other people. I think as a country we over-incarcerate people. I would limit lengthy incarceration it primarily to crimes of violence.

Don't be fooled by the number. Prosecutors often use those numbers to scare defendants and reporters don't really know any better. That's the maximum sentence. In the real world, maximum sentences are extremely rare, especially for a first conviction, especially for "white collar" crimes such as those alleged here. He most likely will be sentenced to probation, possibly with some incarceration on the front end. All of it depends on a lot of things; his sentence may be made worse because of his high profile and the desire to appear non-biased and/or tough on crime, but nothing like 17 years. A lot will also depend on where he scores out under federal sentencing guidelines, although those aren't typically as strictly followed as the ones here in Florida are.

How is it sour grapes? It's ridiculous for people to demand to be treated with respect from a person that they have, again, alternated between calling a child-eating pedophile and a senile, dementia-ridden bumbling puppet. Dimon has a long history of political advocacy, mostly for moderate Dem causes in the late aughts to early 2010s, and shifting rightward (though not dramatically so, since the middle of that decade.

I literally watched the video of him saying it. I'm not missing his point at all, I'm pointing out the ridiculous double standard. He says that Democrats and Biden should "be more respectful of their fellow citizens" while never asking the same from the conservatives. They always get a free pass in these conversations. It's like when media claims that left-wingers "talk down about rural America" but right-wingers are given free reign to say whatever they want about cities. Biden should be more respectful of the "75 million people voting for Trump" but Trump is out giving speeches about how the people who voted against him LITERALLY WANT TO DESTROY THE COUNTRY. I wish the rhetoric from both sides was better, but it's not and Trump is a far more egregious accelerant to that than Biden is.

The hypocrisy from that section of that side of the aisle of demanding civility is hilarious. They've alternated between calling Biden a child-eating pedophile and a bumbling senile puppet since 2020! The double standard they DEMAND be enforced is incredible. ETA: Also, the idea that Dimon has stayed out of politics is wildly untrue.

Kueter is going to make rapid improvements. Not "title threat" improvements, but I think he's a solid AA by the time March rolls around. His effort while gassed was impressive, he pushed thru.

Brenner went with the Ric Flair eye gouge.

Franek finally got burned, been playing with it all year.

*waits patiently for trap to spring*