Mesenbrink transfer

[scourge165]

On 2/2/2023 at 8:33 PM, Husker_Du said:

someone told me (and i never followed up to confirm)

but that at the end of Barry Davis' tenure he only gave full rides or none. 

i'm just telling ya what i was told. 

That is definitely not true. 

He did NOT make a good impression on Wisconsin recruits given how many times he'd been burned and he was giving out full rides for the likes of...Howe, Rutt, Medberry, Graff...but it was definitely not an all or nothing thing. 

 

I can see where it came from. He did have quite a few Wrestlers who got full rides. Jesse Thielke, Destin McCauley...a couple other prospects in that #1 ranked class were offered full rides, but...plenty were offered partials. 

[scourge165]

3 hours ago, Le duke said:

Going to be some high ranking kids transferring out soon, I think.

If Carter doesn't take an OLY, or if Haines goes up and doesn't take his RS, I fear that Facundo will either have to take one, ride the pine or transfer.

This can't even be fun at this point. This is asinine. And I say that with all due respect for PSU, but IF Nagao and Truax end up at PSU...it's going to year after where it's basically PSU vs the field.

125-Howard-He's an AA if that shoulder is healthy...and there's no reason he shouldn't be after finally having it surgically fixed. This is a world Gold Medalist who's still has 4 years left.
133-NC contender. Top 3, if Vito and Fix take OLR, favorites. Don't see him beating Vito, but certainly see him giving Fix a run.  
141-Bartlett, he's a distance 3 behind the top 2, but not so distant he can't close the cap.
Would ANYONE be shocked to see him in the in the finals? 

149-Van Ness-top 3 and looked like the light finally went on. Sasso, Gomez...the Van Ness when the light turned on could win it without anyone being the least bit surprised.
-Hypothetically from here
157-Messenbrink-Immediate NC contender like Haines was this year...probably a stronger NC contender.
165-Haines is a NC contender with O'Toole and Carr, but...an underdog.
174-3X NC
184-(Truax?)3X AA 3 4th place finishes. Or Lucas Cochran takes over. It won't matter. 
197-3X AA
HWT-Kerkvliet 
 

That's 10 AAs, 8 with legitimate chances to win it and you have, in order 4, 3, 2, 3, 4, 3, 2, 1, ?, 2 years of eligibility left.

You've got Lillendal, Sealy, Ryder, Barr, the Mirasolas, Kasak, Mason Gibson, Erik Gibson(which stands to reason Melvin Miller, and then the Bassett brothers. They'll probably get Hopke.

This is...absolutely ridiculous. The NCAAs will still be interested, but the team race will be decided by 149 of the quarters. PSU could legitimately put a team out, add their score up vs the highest finisher NOT Wrestling for PSU and potentially beat them.

 

I enjoy getting to witness greatness. But this is TERRIBLE for our sport. And the last thing I expect is a PSU fan to apologize for building a program that everyone wants to go to, for building a RTC that has the funds to pay for World Champions to come and represent them. 

2-3 years from now, Kerk, Starocci, Brooks are going to be gone and this team could be BETTER than they are now. 

Can we at least create a few co-ops? Like...Ohio State and Michigan(Get over it, it's for the greater good).

Or Iowa and Iowa State?

Missouri and Cornell?

 

 

I really thought he'd be headed to Missou and JUUUST maybe if things broke right, they could...not push PSU, but give them a run. If he ends up at PSU....it'd actually be almost a joke.

[1032004]

On 2/2/2023 at 4:53 AM, scourge165 said:

Edit-Woah...went on a rant that. If this is TLTR, I hope Messenbrink shocks everyone and Wrestles between Hamiti and Gomez, but if he goes to Mizzou, he's the type of guy I believe will be a multi-time NC and have success at the next level. He reminds me of a Lincoln Mcllravy...not quite as physically gifted, but maybe with more of Brands mentality on the mat. Off the mat, apparently he's a super easy going kid, but again, he's EXTREMELY competitive...and you're going to lose some team points with him, but I suspect it'll be worth it.

In fact, I REALLY hope he doesn't go to Mizzou as he's the type of kid to go up to 165 to try and stop O'Toole from winning 4(even if it's a Covid 4, it could be 4). Just that type of kid. So singularly focused.

 

Are Messenbrink and O’Toole friends? Would they do that? Didn’t Askren have his club guys intentionally go different weights so more of them could win state titles?

[scourge165]

6 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Are Messenbrink and O’Toole friends? Would they do that? Didn’t Askren have his club guys intentionally go different weights so more of them could win state titles?

Messenbrink is a different cat. He's HYPER competitive and while Askren did have his guys go to different weights to promote AWA, that was pretty low stakes. Nobody was beating Sinclair at 220 with Mirasola moving up to HWT...so there was really nothing they were risking.

Messenbrink has a unique drive. And I should be clear, i don't think he'd do it to stop O'Toole, I just dont' think he'd care. I mean, it may be some extra motivation, but it wouldn't be the reason.

If he ends up at Mizzou, it'll likely be at '57 and then'65. But if it's PSU, probably '65

[Gus]

11 hours ago, Le duke said:

Going to be some high ranking kids transferring out soon, I think.

If Carter doesn't take an OLY, or if Haines goes up and doesn't take his RS, I fear that Facundo will either have to take one, ride the pine or transfer.

If Messenbrink transfers in, I think he beats Facundo out for the spot. The whole “Haines is moving up to 165 next year” thing has kind of been debunked. He has stated that he doesn’t have a hard cut at all and walks around at 165. 

[nhs67]

13 minutes ago, Gus said:

If Messenbrink transfers in, I think he beats Facundo out for the spot. The whole “Haines is moving up to 165 next year” thing has kind of been debunked. He has stated that he doesn’t have a hard cut at all and walks around at 165. 

I think Facundo beats Mesenbrink.  That doesn't mean Facundo wins the spot, though.  He wrestles very close matches.  He loses matches against worse wrestlers.

[Le duke]

If Messenbrink transfers in, I think he beats Facundo out for the spot. The whole “Haines is moving up to 165 next year” thing has kind of been debunked. He has stated that he doesn’t have a hard cut at all and walks around at 165. 

Well aware. Over on the PSU board I’ve been saying that Haines doesn’t look big for 157, the entire year. Never looked bigger than anyone he wrestled. Stronger? Yes.


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[Gus]

2 hours ago, Le duke said:

Well aware. Over on the PSU board I’ve been saying that Haines doesn’t look big for 157, the entire year. Never looked bigger than anyone he wrestled. Stronger? Yes.


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I agree with you there. He looked like an average sized 157 pounder with country boy strength. 

[scourge165]

4 hours ago, nhs67 said:

I think Facundo beats Mesenbrink.  That doesn't mean Facundo wins the spot, though.  He wrestles very close matches.  He loses matches against worse wrestlers.

I don't think he does. I think Messenbrink will actually beat him pretty soundly. Messenbrink will probably fire off about 45 shots in that match.

He's going to be fun to watch. And I do think Facundo is a stud who was in a loaded weight this year, so it's no slight against him. 

[scourge165]

3 hours ago, Le duke said:

Well aware. Over on the PSU board I’ve been saying that Haines doesn’t look big for 157, the entire year. Never looked bigger than anyone he wrestled. Stronger? Yes.


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Well, Cael said, "not long for," not that it was a huge cut yet. Maybe he's just...inferring that they expect him to add some muscle and with his frame, develop into a '65? 

I doubt there's a huge difference in size between Messenbrink and Haines, so if it'd make sense Haines stays at 157 this year. But they could also RS him this year, let Messenbrink wrestle '57 and then let one go up to '65. Maybe Facundo grows into '74 by then?

I don't know, it's really not a problem. They're going to have NC caliber Wrestlers in several weight of those weights for the foreseeable future. 

[flyingcement]

Sad for competitive balance if he goes to Penn State.  But it's also the best place of maximizing his potential so can't blame him

[CementMixer]

12 hours ago, nhs67 said:

I think Facundo beats Mesenbrink.  That doesn't mean Facundo wins the spot, though.  He wrestles very close matches.  He loses matches against worse wrestlers.

Mesenbrink will major Facundo in the room. Please.

[Le duke]

Mesenbrink will major Facundo in the room. Please.

I don’t think he majors him but he’s going to put up points that Facundo can’t match.

That said, guys seem to make a jump in year three at PSU. See: Beau Bartlett.

Maybe Facundo will develop a couple of good keg attacks. I’d love to see Penn State have a Shak-Cassar situation with two legit top 5-10 guys.


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[BlacknGold]

Maybe Facundo should transfer. His fan base sends a lot of negativity his way and now he's been recruited over. God forbid you don't win a national title as a freshman 

[Le duke]

Maybe Facundo should transfer. His fan base sends a lot of negativity his way and now he's been recruited over. God forbid you don't win a national title as a freshman 

Irony: Hawkeye fan telling a Penn State fan that objective assessment of talent/progress is “negativity”.

Go over to HR/GIA and read all of the comments from the incredibly deluded mega donors who think HWC is on par with NLWC.

FWIW, I have been and remain a fan of Facundo.


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[flyingcement]

1 hour ago, CementMixer said:

Mesenbrink will major Facundo in the room. Please.

Major if Facundo is lucky. 

[scourge165]

50 minutes ago, BlacknGold said:

Maybe Facundo should transfer. His fan base sends a lot of negativity his way and now he's been recruited over. God forbid you don't win a national title as a freshman 

It's not a slight against Facundo...it's more about Messenbrink.

I think Facundo could be an AA next year. I think Messenrbink COULD beat anyone in the weight, even if they're all back next year.

[BlacknGold]

Facundo definitely been taking heat from psu fans, and now Mesenbrink and Josh Barr are on the way? Yikes...

[nhs67]

6 hours ago, BlacknGold said:

Facundo definitely been taking heat from psu fans, and now Mesenbrink and Josh Barr are on the way? Yikes...

Best friends for 15 years, mate.  Lading Barr had more to do wth Facundo being there than Penn State.

[Elevator]

I expect Facundo to hit his stride soon and just had some bad mojo at NCAA's this year.  Every program will have some boneheaded fans who are overly critical of wrestling below seed and early expectations.  

[BlacknGold]

Looks like a log jam at middleweights

[CementMixer]

8 hours ago, BlacknGold said:

Looks like a log jam at middleweights

Say goodbye to Kennedy then. 

[Ivan Stankowski]

On 2/1/2023 at 9:45 PM, scourge165 said:

I would be surprised if Wisc offered 40%. 

That's a pretty big scholarship and...really quite rare. If Wisconsin offered 40%, they believed in him a lot more than the stories from the Askren camp would suggest. Plus, as I heard it, Barry was pretty gunshy about...again, Wisconsin Wrestlers. The few truly elite Wrestlers from the state did little at UW. There was a guy Erick Swick who was an absolute beast(beat Sanderson the summer each was heading into their Fresh year). Won numerous NCs, International accomplishments, Dennis Hall, another Espoir World Champ, World Champ at the Sr level, Olympic Silver, there were others, but he'd been burned. Jesse Thielke and Destin McCauley(those were after, but still). 

Anyway, 100% scholarships are...pretty rare. You get 9.9. I don't know, but I thought it was quite a bit lower...and as I said, I don't believe they DID believe in him. I think he's correct on that front. But again...who he was a HS Wrestler and what he became...that's a WIIIDE chasm. Not sure there were a lot of Colleges who were going to give big money to Ben...

Hell, Wisconsin is probably a powerhouse right now if they do. Keegan O'Toole, Keckhiesen, Messenbrink are likely in the lineup with Hopke, Sinclair, Mirasola and a few others on the way...plus guys I'm forgetting. Greyson Clark, Millard, they've got a lot of kids who are excelling at the next level all the sudden...and almost all of them are doing it OUTSIDE the land of 15,000 lakes(10,000 doesn't sound so impressive now, does it Minnesota).

 

It was very well known that most Wisconsin wrestlers were offered less then Out of state wrestlers By BD, It was kind of the expectation it should be a privilege and honor and not so much compensated for wrestling in state, not sure that theory panned out so well for BD 

 

[scourge165]

3 hours ago, Ivan Stankowski said:

It was very well known that most Wisconsin wrestlers were offered less then Out of state wrestlers By BD, It was kind of the expectation it should be a privilege and honor and not so much compensated for wrestling in state, not sure that theory panned out so well for BD 

 

I think it was because he got burned so many times. Wisconsin wrestlers did NOT do well at Wisconsin for a very long time. The guys that were ranked highly Nationally...struggled. 

I just don't think he thought there was a whole lot of in-state talent...and there wasn't. There's more now, but I'm trying to think, who other than Henning since Jetton has been in the finals? When was the last Wisconsin NC? Guys like Swick, Lewis, the Crass brothers...Beau Breske(who came after going to Neb).

Lowney and Konrad were always going to Minnesota(Konrad especially after Lowney did). 

Tim Hartung was a guy who had to beg Minnesota just to walk on. He sent them letters and clippings all year and they were recruiting a kid from Iowa...until they saw him go out to Sr Nats and Hartung put one on the other kid they were recruiting. 

Barry gave a lot of those guys full scholarships. Others he offered, but there were academic issues...not dumb kids or terrible grades, but guys they just couldn't get in through admissions. Sucks, but what it is.

[jchapman]

23 hours ago, scourge165 said:

I think it was because he got burned so many times. Wisconsin wrestlers did NOT do well at Wisconsin for a very long time. The guys that were ranked highly Nationally...struggled. 

I just don't think he thought there was a whole lot of in-state talent...and there wasn't. There's more now, but I'm trying to think, who other than Henning since Jetton has been in the finals? When was the last Wisconsin NC? Guys like Swick, Lewis, the Crass brothers...Beau Breske(who came after going to Neb).

Lowney and Konrad were always going to Minnesota(Konrad especially after Lowney did). 

Tim Hartung was a guy who had to beg Minnesota just to walk on. He sent them letters and clippings all year and they were recruiting a kid from Iowa...until they saw him go out to Sr Nats and Hartung put one on the other kid they were recruiting. 

Barry gave a lot of those guys full scholarships. Others he offered, but there were academic issues...not dumb kids or terrible grades, but guys they just couldn't get in through admissions. Sucks, but what it is.

Correct, Henning was the last Wisconsin native in the finals for UW.  Andy Rein was the last champ in 1980.