NormMacDonald Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 (edited) I’d put Angle and Gwiz at 4 and 5. Angle should have been a 3X and Gwiz had a great match against Snyder in the finals. Edited May 30 by NormMacDonald Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammerlock3 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 1 hour ago, NM1965 said: Who are you referring to? that you have steveson #1 on a list of college HWYs. No offense, this is one of my opinions that most people seem to think is stupid. 1 1 "Half measures are a coward's form of insanity." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPhillips Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 3 minutes ago, Hammerlock3 said: this is one of my opinions that most people seem to think is stupid. I don't believe this one is stupid... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ionel Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 11 minutes ago, NormMacDonald said: I’d put Angle and Gwiz at 4 and 5. Angle should have been a 3X and Gwiz had a great match against Snyder in the finals. So we are going with the shoulda now? In that case Hutton shoulda been a 4x undefeated NC if not for a tie match in finals his Jr year and a silly referee decision. If that'd been the case we'd never have been talking about that Cael guy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammerlock3 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 this topic is also committing the heretical omission of ignoring the idea Ferrari goes HWY in the future, in which case he slots in at 4 at the lowest. "Half measures are a coward's form of insanity." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ionel Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 19 minutes ago, Hammerlock3 said: this is one of my opinions that most people seem to think is stupid. 14 minutes ago, MPhillips said: I don't believe this one is stupid... You can trust MP on this one. He knows stupid when he sees it. If MP says it ain't stupid you are good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gantry Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 2 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said: The case for Steveson has to be based on highest high rather than any sustained success. But if that is the criteria I think Snyder pips him. Steveson has 2 AAs, 2 titles, and an Olympic Gold while in college. Meanwhile Snyder has 3 AAs, 3 titles, and an Olympic Gold while in college. Do you ding Snyder for having his gold at 97kg, or do you acknowledge that 97kg (~213 lb) is still heavy in college? Synder gets dinged because he lost a match his senior year where Gable was pretty much untouchable his last two years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NM1965 Posted May 31 Author Share Posted May 31 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Hammerlock3 said: that you have steveson #1 on a list of college HWYs. No offense, this is one of my opinions that most people seem to think is stupid. Nobody else seems to have a problem with me putting Gable first. In fact, most here seem to agree with me. Also, your complaint is illogical. Would it MATTER if Gable never wrestled another college match? What heavies do you think would beat him? I don't think your opinion is stupid, but I do disagree with you. Edited May 31 by NM1965 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammerlock3 Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 2 minutes ago, NM1965 said: Nobody else seems to have a problem with me putting Gable first. In fact, most here seem to agree with me. Also, your complaint is illogical. Would it MATTER if Gable never wrestled another college match? What heavies do you think would beat him? well at least one person seems to agree. But moving forward, you think greatest is the person, who in their prime, could beat anyone else in their prime? I presume that's your criteria? I'm being logical so I won't rush ahead before we know what we're talking about. "Half measures are a coward's form of insanity." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boconnell Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 2 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said: The case for Steveson has to be based on highest high rather than any sustained success. But if that is the criteria I think Snyder pips him. Steveson has 2 AAs, 2 titles, and an Olympic Gold while in college. Meanwhile Snyder has 3 AAs, 3 titles, and an Olympic Gold while in college. Do you ding Snyder for having his gold at 97kg, or do you acknowledge that 97kg (~213 lb) is still heavy in college? For me I have Snyder, Steveson, Hutton, Haselrig, and Mocco as my top 5. I think part of Steveson being so highly regarded is how he won his title. He crushed 2X world medalist Gwiz in two matches to make the team. Then he beat 4X Olympic and World champ Akgul in the semis 8-0. Then he beat 3X world reigning champ Petiashvili in the gold medal match. So that's the next best USA heavy of the past decade, and the two best international heavies of the past decade in a single gold medal run. Snyder has a comparable win over Sadulaev, but it didn't come while he was in college. He doesn't have a win on the level of Akgul or Petriashvilli while still in college. He also didn't have to beat anyone domestic at Gwiz' level. Steveson had probably the best couple month run of any college kid ever at any weight. And I agree Mocco is hanging around the top 5, but I can't put him over Konrad who had his way with him while both were at their peak. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunaticfringe Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 (edited) Steveson, Snyder, Neal, Haselrig, Konrad Edited May 31 by Lunaticfringe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ionel Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 14 minutes ago, Lunaticfringe said: Steveson, Snyder, Neal, Haselrig, Konrad How many D1 national championships did each win? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatDane67 Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 Hodge Award winners.. 2023 Mason Parris 285 Senior Michigan 2022 Gable Steveson 285 Senior Minnesota 2021 Spencer Lee & Gable Steveson 125, 285 Senior, Junior Iowa, Minnesota 2020 Spencer Lee 125 Junior Iowa 2019 Bo Nickal 197 Senior Penn State 2018 Zain Retherford 149 Senior Penn State 2017 Zain Retherford 149 Junior Penn State 2016 Alex Dieringer 165 Senior Oklahoma State 2015 Logan Stieber 141 Senior Ohio State 2014 David Taylor 165 Senior Penn State 2013 Kyle Dake 165 Senior Cornell 2012 David Taylor 165 Sophomore Penn State 2011 Jordan Burroughs 165 Senior Nebraska 2010 Jayson Ness 133 Senior Minnesota 2009 Jake Herbert 184 Senior Northwestern 2008 Brent Metcalf 149 Sophomore Iowa 2007 Ben Askren 174 Senior Missouri 2006 Ben Askren 174 Junior Missouri 2005 Steve Mocco 285 Junior Oklahoma State 2004 Emmett Willson 197 Senior Mont. State-Northern 2003 Eric Larkin 149 Senior Arizona State 2002 Cael Sanderson 197 Senior Iowa State 2001 Cael Sanderson & Nick Ackerman 184, 174 Junior, Senior Iowa State, Simpson College 2000 Cael Sanderson 184 Sophomore Iowa State 1999 Stephen Neal 285 Senior CSU Bakersfield 1998 Mark Ironside 134 Senior Iowa 1997 Kerry McCoy 285 Senior Penn State 1996 Les Gutches 177 Senior Oregon State 1995 T.J. Jaworsky 134 Senior North Carolina Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPhillips Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 1 hour ago, ionel said: You can trust MP on this one. Like EF 'MF' Hutton... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestleknownothing Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 1 hour ago, GreatDane67 said: Hodge Award winners.. 2023 Mason Parris 285 Senior Michigan 2022 Gable Steveson 285 Senior Minnesota 2021 Spencer Lee & Gable Steveson 125, 285 Senior, Junior Iowa, Minnesota 2020 Spencer Lee 125 Junior Iowa 2019 Bo Nickal 197 Senior Penn State 2018 Zain Retherford 149 Senior Penn State 2017 Zain Retherford 149 Junior Penn State 2016 Alex Dieringer 165 Senior Oklahoma State 2015 Logan Stieber 141 Senior Ohio State 2014 David Taylor 165 Senior Penn State 2013 Kyle Dake 165 Senior Cornell 2012 David Taylor 165 Sophomore Penn State 2011 Jordan Burroughs 165 Senior Nebraska 2010 Jayson Ness 133 Senior Minnesota 2009 Jake Herbert 184 Senior Northwestern 2008 Brent Metcalf 149 Sophomore Iowa 2007 Ben Askren 174 Senior Missouri 2006 Ben Askren 174 Junior Missouri 2005 Steve Mocco 285 Junior Oklahoma State 2004 Emmett Willson 197 Senior Mont. State-Northern 2003 Eric Larkin 149 Senior Arizona State 2002 Cael Sanderson 197 Senior Iowa State 2001 Cael Sanderson & Nick Ackerman 184, 174 Junior, Senior Iowa State, Simpson College 2000 Cael Sanderson 184 Sophomore Iowa State 1999 Stephen Neal 285 Senior CSU Bakersfield 1998 Mark Ironside 134 Senior Iowa 1997 Kerry McCoy 285 Senior Penn State 1996 Les Gutches 177 Senior Oregon State 1995 T.J. Jaworsky 134 Senior North Carolina That formatting hurts my head Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestleknownothing Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 2 hours ago, ionel said: So we are going with the shoulda now? In that case Hutton shoulda been a 4x undefeated NC if not for a tie match in finals his Jr year and a silly referee decision. If that'd been the case we'd never have been talking about that Cael guy. They should change your emoji from banana to cherry cause your cherrypicking Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ionel Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 Just now, Wrestleknownothing said: They should change your emoji from banana to cherry cause your cherrypicking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AgaveMaria Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 He was not top 5 but my vote for most entertaining Heavyweight goes to Curly Culp at Arizona State where he won the School its first NCAA title in wrestling. He was non stop on the mat and sounded like a Steam Engine as he plowed forward and took opponents apart. Played Football at ASU and then in the Pro's and is in the NFL Hall of Fame. ” Never attribute to inspiration that which can be adequately explained by delusion”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackwebster Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 12 hours ago, ionel said: Idk, never head of McReady. You're such a weirdo about typos. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
11986 Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 (edited) no love for Kerry McCoy? After a lackluster freshman year at 190, we went 131-1 at heavy, won 88 matches in a row, 1-3-1 at NCAAs, Hodge winner. Beat Neal in finals for his 2nd title (granted Neal was a soph). not sure he's top 5 just surprised I haven't seen his name other than on the Hodge winner list that was posted. or maybe I missed it. Dan Gable famously held out Wes Hand from wrestling McCoy in dual Hand's freshman year. Hand of course went on to be a finalist but at that point Gable said he hadn't earned the right to wrestle someone like McCoy. Of course, this was in a dual Iowa had locked up heading into the last match. PSU crowd was pissed. Edited May 31 by 11986 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 18 minutes ago, 11986 said: no love for Kerry McCoy? After a lackluster freshman year at 190, we went 131-1 at heavy, won 88 matches in a row, 1-3-1 at NCAAs, Hodge winner. Beat Neal in finals for his 2nd title (granted Neal was a soph). not sure he's top 5 just surprised I haven't seen his name other than on the Hodge winner list that was posted. or maybe I missed it. Dan Gable famously held out Wes Hand from wrestling McCoy in dual Hand's freshman year. Hand of course went on to be a finalist but at that point Gable said he hadn't earned the right to wrestle someone like McCoy. Of course, this was in a dual Iowa had locked up heading into the last match. PSU crowd was pissed. I thought he was also trying not to torpedo Hand's confidence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
11986 Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 16 minutes ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said: I thought he was also trying not to torpedo Hand's confidence? maybe? I think he might have also been trying to piss him off. Gable was great at figuring his guys out and pushing the right buttons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 9 minutes ago, 11986 said: maybe? I think he might have also been trying to piss him off. Gable was great at figuring his guys out and pushing the right buttons. If I remember correctly, Gable wasn't even there. He relayed the instructions to Zalesky. This was covered in "A Season on the Mat," and my copy is in another state at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammerlock3 Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 13 minutes ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said: If I remember correctly, Gable wasn't even there. He relayed the instructions to Zalesky. This was covered in "A Season on the Mat," and my copy is in another state at the moment. I remember comments to that effect. Hand had potential and putting him up against mccoy to get embarrassed wasn't worth it. Also remember that being during gables hiatus. 1 "Half measures are a coward's form of insanity." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
11986 Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 15 minutes ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said: If I remember correctly, Gable wasn't even there. He relayed the instructions to Zalesky. This was covered in "A Season on the Mat," and my copy is in another state at the moment. love that book and was at the dual, not recalling whether Gable was there or not right this sec but you might be right with the hip issues he was having he might not have traveled for that one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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