Are all the Pro-Palestine, anti Israel protests helping or hurting the Democrats?

[JimmyBT]

12 hours ago, uncle bernard said:

If Israel didn’t kick Palestinians out of their homes in the first place none of this would have happened. 

I get you guys didn’t pay attention before 10/7, but this started long before that. 

This goes back to the failure to right the wrongs of the Nakba. 700k Palestinians ethnically cleansed from where they lived for hundreds of years. Israel created a permanent refugee population of several million people. Whether you support Israel or not, that is a bad idea for peace. That’s like “How to Start a Terror Group 101.”

Their strategy is to try to keep the lid on the pot to keep it boiling over - Permanent occupation of the West Bank and blockade of Gaza. It’s time to turn off the stove like a sane person. 

Before Hamas?  Like in 1948 when on the day after the Isarali people were put where they are five Arab countries declared war on them??   Some of us follow it further back before Oct 7 than others.  
 

[JimmyBT]

12 hours ago, uncle bernard said:

hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas us evil hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas us evil hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas is evil hamas us evil hamas is evil hamas is evil

 

i’ve said it a million times before. i think we all have that one covered. if anybody disagrees that hamas is evil, please speak now. 

Hamas is a terrorist organization with the goal of eradicating a group of humans that they don’t see as humans.  The Palestinian people can get rid of Hamas, IF they want to.  Too bad they don’t. 

[uncle bernard]

3 hours ago, JimmyBT said:

Hamas is a terrorist organization with the goal of eradicating a group of humans that they don’t see as humans.  The Palestinian people can get rid of Hamas, IF they want to.  Too bad they don’t. 

How? 

[uncle bernard]

13 hours ago, Bigbrog said:

Man...you are so wrong on so many levels...I have a feeling you are realizing it after spending so many days living in a tent on a campus thinking you are doing something good.  Some day you will realize you are wrong, have been wrong, and aren't as smart as you think you are.  

Just quit defending hamas and spending all your time blaming Israel...

In 10 years, you'll pretend you were always skeptical of Israel's war. Student protest movements have an almost 100% hit rate. Just like Civil Rights, Vietnam, Apartheid, Iraq War, etc...history will be on our side again. 

In the meantime, have fun defending the slaughter of 15,000 children. I'm the only one on here who is unequivocal that killing children is wrong, no matter who does it.  

[Bigbrog]

14 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

In 10 years, you'll pretend you were always skeptical of Israel's war. Student protest movements have an almost 100% hit rate. Just like Civil Rights, Vietnam, Apartheid, Iraq War, etc...history will be on our side again. 

In the meantime, have fun defending the slaughter of 15,000 children. I'm the only one on here who is unequivocal that killing children is wrong, no matter who does it.  

First paragraph...LOL...not even worth commenting on because it is so ridiculous.

Second paragraph...show on here where ANYEONE is defending the slaughter of 15,000 children, by the way, which propaganda anti-semetic literature did you and your crazy protesters get that from?  Any innocent civilian casualties are a travesty; however, 99% of the people on here blame the terrorist group and hold them responsible...yet you defend them and try and blame the people who were attacked, who warn the Palestinians when they are going to retaliate, and who try and provide aid which gets blocked by your terrorist buddies.

[uncle bernard]

11 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

First paragraph...LOL...not even worth commenting on because it is so ridiculous.

Second paragraph...show on here where ANYEONE is defending the slaughter of 15,000 children, by the way, which propaganda anti-semetic literature did you and your crazy protesters get that from?  Any innocent civilian casualties are a travesty; however, 99% of the people on here blame the terrorist group and hold them responsible...yet you defend them and try and blame the people who were attacked, who warn the Palestinians when they are going to retaliate, and who try and provide aid which gets blocked by your terrorist buddies.

Show me where I defend Hamas? I call them evil and say they are legitimate targets on nearly every page of this thread and that doesn't stop you from calling me a Hamas lover.

Plus, you do defend it because you place 100% of the blame on Hamas for using human shields. They do use shields, but Israel is still making the decision to drop the bombs knowing civilians are present and will be killed. That is a choice. Hamas is culpable, but that does not absolve Israel from its responsibility. 

Israel's occupation makes Hamas' resistance legal under international law. It *does not* make the killing of civilians legal and Hamas is culpable for those terrible crimes even though Israel bears some responsibility for the illegal occupation that leads to it. Likewise, Hamas is culpable for using human shields. That is a crime. It does not mean that Israel is free to kill those civilians.

And 15,000 dead children isn't anti-Semitic propaganda. It's a fact. There are 15,000 dead children and Israel dropped the bombs that killed them. And you are against a ceasefire that would stop that killing, so you support its continuation.

Edited May 23 by uncle bernard

[mspart]

16 hours ago, uncle bernard said:

they don’t follow international law. it still applies to them. the law still applies to criminals. that’s kind of the whole point.

this should not be that hard. 

the ICC issued arrest warrants for Hamas too. you’re the one who only wants the law to apply to one side. 

You said it.   You are the one who said only Israel has to abide by international law.   True story.   You should explain your meaning in that post rather than try to twist my words.   It isn't that complicated man.   Come on man!

mspart

[uncle bernard]

1 minute ago, mspart said:

You said it.   You are the one who said only Israel has to abide by international law.   True story.   You should explain your meaning in that post rather than try to twist my words.   It isn't that complicated man.   Come on man!

mspart

No, that's not what I said lol. Hamas still has to follow international law. They just don't. Because they're a terror group. They're evil. Criminals still have to abide by the law. 

The difference is that I want both Hamas and Israel prosecuted for crimes. You only want Hamas prosecuted for crimes. You don't want the law to apply to everyone.

 

[uncle bernard]

@mspart

Here's what it comes down to for you: Israel doesn't have to follow international law because Hamas broke the law. If that's not what you believe, correct me.

Example: Hamas embeds itself in civilian locations. Therefore, Israel now has the right to kill those civilians.

[mspart]

16 hours ago, uncle bernard said:

If Israel didn’t kick Palestinians out of their homes in the first place none of this would have happened.  

I get you guys didn’t pay attention before 10/7, but this started long before that. 

This goes back to the failure to right the wrongs of the Nakba. 700k Palestinians ethnically cleansed from where they lived for hundreds of years. Israel created a permanent refugee population of several million people. Whether you support Israel or not, that is a bad idea for peace. That’s like “How to Start a Terror Group 101.”

Their strategy is to try to keep the lid on the pot to keep it boiling over - Permanent occupation of the West Bank and blockade of Gaza. It’s time to turn off the stove like a sane person. 

Whatever makes you feel better.    You want to conflate this.   If they had not done Oct 7, there would be no bombing of Gaza.   There would  be no misery in Gaza except as Hamas dictates to their own people.   Israel provided electricity, water, fuel, and food to Gaza until Oct 7.   If there is any complaint, it should be against Hamas who miscalculated international support.   Because of Hamas, Gaza is a now a parking lot rather than a beautiful area in which to live and thrive.  And they have made that the case since 2006 when Israel unilaterally gave Gaza to the Palestinans.   Israel has offered many times a two state solution and it was rejected by the Palestinians each and every time.   They don't want a two state solution.   They want Israel eliminated.   That is where war and suffering starts. 

Please remember that in Palestinian areas, Jews are not allowed.   In Israel, there are Palestinians in the Knesset.   Palestinians live in Israel.   You may be able to deduce who the intolerant are here. 

mspart

[uncle bernard]

9 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

@mspart

Here's what it comes down to for you: Israel doesn't have to follow international law because Hamas broke the law. If that's not what you believe, correct me.

Example: Hamas embeds itself in civilian locations. Therefore, Israel now has the right to kill those civilians.

anybody is welcome to jump in and answer this, not just @mspart

Does Hamas' breaking of international law mean that Israel no longer has to follow the law in response?

Simple question. What's your answer?

[mspart]

13 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

@mspart

Here's what it comes down to for you: Israel doesn't have to follow international law because Hamas broke the law. If that's not what you believe, correct me.

Example: Hamas embeds itself in civilian locations. Therefore, Israel now has the right to kill those civilians.

You conveniently ignore reality UB.   Israel warns everyone where and when they will strike.   That is beyond what International Law requires and more than any other nation has done during war.  How can anyone fight a war in such a way.   They do that because of Hamas' tactics of using civilians as human shields, against your vaunted international law.   Then if the civilians don't clear it is either their fault for not clearing out to safety or it is Hamas' fault for either contradicting the Israeli warning or threatening the civilians that they must stay.   Hamas does not care for the Palestinian people.   The more that get slaughter the better is their thought.   They do not feel those people are their responsibility to protect and defend.   They have said that is the UN's responsibility.  

Please explain, how, with all the aid that has gone their way, they are in the deepest poverty and still depend on others to provide water, food, fuel, and electricity?   Others is defined as Israel.   Gaza should be a veritable paradise with all the monetary aid they have been given.   Further proof as Hamas uses the aid for enriching themselves and building tunnels and buying armaments that the poverty is the fault of Hamas.   They are as corrupt as it gets.   They are not there for the people, they are there to kill as many Israelis as possible.   And if they die, they get 70 virgins in the afterlife.   So all is good. 

mspart

Edited May 23 by mspart

[uncle bernard]

3 minutes ago, mspart said:

You conveniently ignore reality UB.   Israel warns everyone where and when they will strike.   That is beyond what International Law requires and more than any other nation has done during war.  How can anyone fight a war in such a way.   They do that because of Hamas' tactics of using civilians as human shields, against your vaunted international law.   Then if the civilians don't clear it is either their fault for not clearing out to safety or it is Hamas' fault for either contradicting the Israeli warning or threatening the civilians that they must stay.   Hamas does not care for the Palestinian people.   The more that get slaughter the better is their thought.   They do not feel those people are their responsibility to protect and defend.   They have said that is the UN's responsibility.  

Please explain, how, with all the aid that has gone their way, they are in the deepest poverty and still depend on others to provide water, food, fuel, and electricity?   Others is defined as Israel.   Gaza should be a veritable paradise with all the monetary aid they have been given.   Further proof as Hamas uses the aid for enriching themselves and building tunnels and buying armaments that the poverty is the fault of Hamas.   They are as corrupt as it gets.   They are not there for the people, they are there to kill as many Israelis as possible.   And if they die, they get 70 virgins in the afterlife.   So all is good. 

mspart

This is not true.

Answer the question directly: Does Israel have to follow International Law if Hamas breaks it?

[mspart]

56 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

This is not true.

Answer the question directly: Does Israel have to follow International Law if Hamas breaks it?

Israel warns everyone where and when they will strike.   That is beyond what International Law requires and more than any other nation has done during war. 

Yes UB, Israel follows international law.   But they must prosecute the war against a lawless entity.  Give the warning, then others are responsible for the result. 

Does Hamas have to follow International Law?   You say they should but do not.   That's very convenient.   What you are saying is that Israel cannot prosecute a war against Hamas because Hamas uses human shields.   Your logic is twisted and shows your bias to Hamas, as you have denied all along but has been proven all along as well.

mspart

 

[braves121]

2 minutes ago, mspart said:

Israel warns everyone where and when they will strike.   That is beyond what International Law requires and more than any other nation has done during war. 

Yes UB, Israel follows international law.   But they must prosecute the war against a lawless entity.  Give the warning, then others are responsible for the result. 

Does Hamas have to follow International Law?   You say they should but do not.   That's very convenient.   What you are saying is that Israel cannot prosecute a war against Hamas because Hamas uses human shields.   Your logic is twisted and shows your bias to Hamas, as you have denied all along but has been proven all along as well.

mspart

 

Lot of mental gymnastics there you are doing

Edited May 23 by braves121

[mspart]

Not really.   It is reality.   It is a lot of mental gymnastics for UB and apparently you to support Hamas. 

mspart

[braves121]

7 minutes ago, mspart said:

Israel warns everyone where and when they will strike.   That is beyond what International Law requires and more than any other nation has done during war. 

Yes UB, Israel follows international law.   But they must prosecute the war against a lawless entity.  Give the warning, then others are responsible for the result. 

Does Hamas have to follow International Law?   You say they should but do not.   That's very convenient.   What you are saying is that Israel cannot prosecute a war against Hamas because Hamas uses human shields.   Your logic is twisted and shows your bias to Hamas, as you have denied all along but has been proven all along as well.

mspart

 

I mean Israel does not really follow international law, they have broadcasted all the war crimes they have committed lol

[uncle bernard]

5 minutes ago, mspart said:

Israel warns everyone where and when they will strike.   That is beyond what International Law requires and more than any other nation has done during war. 

Yes UB, Israel follows international law.   But they must prosecute the war against a lawless entity.  Give the warning, then others are responsible for the result. 

Does Hamas have to follow International Law?   You say they should but do not.   That's very convenient.   What you are saying is that Israel cannot prosecute a war against Hamas because Hamas uses human shields.   Your logic is twisted and shows your bias to Hamas, as you have denied all along but has been proven all along as well.

mspart

 

1) They do not notify everyone when and where they strike. They do that for a very limited amount of strikes. That is not representative of their typical practice, especially in Gaza right now. That's how they ended killing those food workers.

2) Israel *can* prosecute a war against Hamas. They *can't* kill human shields with bombs because it's easier. That's a war crime. If Israel wants to break the law like Hamas, they should be prosecuted like Hamas.

Yes or no, does international law apply to Israel? Please answer directly. Start with Yes/No, then go into your explanation.

[mspart]

26 minutes ago, mspart said:

Israel warns everyone where and when they will strike.   That is beyond what International Law requires and more than any other nation has done during war. 

Yes UB, Israel follows international law.  

mspart

 

16 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Yes or no, does international law apply to Israel? Please answer directly. Start with Yes/No, then go into your explanation.

It would help if you would read. 

mspart

[uncle bernard]

1 minute ago, mspart said:

It would help if you would read. 

mspart

That isn't true, nor would it answer the question if it were.

Why won't you answer directly?

Is Israel subject to international law? Yes or no?

[JimmyBT]

2 hours ago, uncle bernard said:

In 10 years, you'll pretend you were always skeptical of Israel's war. Student protest movements have an almost 100% hit rate. Just like Civil Rights, Vietnam, Apartheid, Iraq War, etc...history will be on our side again. 

In the meantime, have fun defending the slaughter of 15,000 children. I'm the only one on here who is unequivocal that killing children is wrong, no matter who does it.  

Yet you’re only protesting the children killed on one side but not the other. Hmmmmmmmmm

[JimmyBT]

2 hours ago, uncle bernard said:

How? 

They know where they are.  Give them up.  Or better yet, since there’s only half of them left don’t let them come back.  They can take them out themselves.  But, again, they don’t want to. 

Edited May 23 by JimmyBT

[braves121]

At the end of the day how many dead civilians are worth 1 dead Hamas operative? 1? 5? 10? 20?

[JimmyBT]

At the end of the day how couldn’t it be a win win if the Palestinians got rid of Hamas themselves? 

[braves121]

2 minutes ago, JimmyBT said:

At the end of the day how couldn’t it be a win win if the Palestinians got rid of Hamas themselves? 

How do you propose they do that? 

Edited May 23 by braves121