Stalling on feet - help clarify

[Dark Energy]

My perspective:  Wrestler not taking risks / not trying upper body moves / no trying real leg attacks …. and generally back to line.  Going on for good period of time.   Bam - stalling!
 

What I see:  Ref sees the above, notices there is an aggressor, …. but does not call stalling until opponent takes ANOTHER shot.   Why do the refs wait like this?  Why can’t they call stalling even when the two are simply hand fighting?

[JuanMogen]

Levi got hit for stalling four seconds after taking a shot on Lewan. There are no rules about stalls. 

[Caveira]

Carr took two shots in like 2 seconds.  Got hit for stalling 3 seconds later with the ref sort of looking away     
 

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/F4U17LCSuVnx1cUc/?mibextid=UalRPS

Edited March 26 by Caveira

[1032004]

9 minutes ago, Caveira said:

Carr took two shots in like 2 seconds.  Got hit for stalling 3 seconds later with the ref sort of looking away     
 

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/F4U17LCSuVnx1cUc/?mibextid=UalRPS

That’s the guy from Davis/Kilkeary too…

[wrestle87]

Ultimately, stalling is about engagement enforcement, and exists to craft the bounds of the competition setting.  The OB stalling and 5-count stalling were really good a few years ago because they were a bigger part of strategy, and got in the way of what many wrestlers used to navigate sticky situations.  

Now, however, it has gotten pretty bad.  Wrestlers have learned "oh, I can actually back my ass all the way out, running practically, but if I circle back in at the last second, no stalling for me.

Referees have gotten lazy about enforcing good ol' regular "you're not wrestling and are avoiding meaningful engagement, you sir, are stalling".

Meaningful engagement and "presenting yourself" for wrestling is a big part of this.  That's why Lewan almost never got hit for stalling.  Did he take a ton of shots, no, but he stood there with his arms pretty wide open, standing up pretty straight, he wasn't really bicycle-happy.  

And...yeah, there were some ATROCIOUS referee performances this year in the finals. 

[Caveira]

8 minutes ago, wrestle87 said:

Ultimately, stalling is about engagement enforcement, and exists to craft the bounds of the competition setting.  The OB stalling and 5-count stalling were really good a few years ago because they were a bigger part of strategy, and got in the way of what many wrestlers used to navigate sticky situations.  

Now, however, it has gotten pretty bad.  Wrestlers have learned "oh, I can actually back my ass all the way out, running practically, but if I circle back in at the last second, no stalling for me.

Referees have gotten lazy about enforcing good ol' regular "you're not wrestling and are avoiding meaningful engagement, you sir, are stalling".

Meaningful engagement and "presenting yourself" for wrestling is a big part of this.  That's why Lewan almost never got hit for stalling.  Did he take a ton of shots, no, but he stood there with his arms pretty wide open, standing up pretty straight, he wasn't really bicycle-happy.  

And...yeah, there were some ATROCIOUS referee performances this year in the finals. 

Yes.  I think it’s nuanced.  But every rule changed (probably not every) gets exploited.  It was called correctly in the past.  We don’t need 5000 new rules to enforce this.  Refs just need to enforce it.   Why they called it like crazy 10/15/20 years ago and not now is insane.   

[ChickenWing]

Add Passivity call. 

Second period never starts 0-0.

 

[Caveira]

1 minute ago, ChickenWing said:

Add Passivity call. 

Second period never starts 0-0.

 

Freestyle rules are weird.   If messenbrink wrestled messenbrink who would get called for stalling in the first period.   Stupid rule imo.   
 

show me attendance at wtt / ott / us open vs NCAAs.   One sport is clearly superior for fans…. The other one not as much.   Please don’t turn us to freestyle cause the sport will be dead.  

[ChickenWing]

10 minutes ago, Caveira said:

Freestyle rules are weird.   If messenbrink wrestled messenbrink who would get called for stalling in the first period.   Stupid rule imo.   
 

show me attendance at wtt / ott / us open vs NCAAs.   One sport is clearly superior for fans…. The other one not as much.   Please don’t turn us to freestyle cause the sport will be dead.  

Messenbrink v Messenbrink: I guarantee Messenbrink would have a takedown in the first period.

Passivity call would only affect the matches the fans already hate and boo.

Attendance means nothing. School spirit will always outdraw the Olympians. 

[Caveira]

10 minutes ago, ChickenWing said:

Messenbrink v Messenbrink: I guarantee Messenbrink would have a takedown in the first period.

Passivity call would only affect the matches the fans already hate and boo.

Attendance means nothing. School spirit will always outdraw the Olympians. 

Yes attendance (viewership) does not equal $$$.    And $$$ does not equal tv coverage and/or streaming coverage.   Fringe sports need fans Or they will not be as accessible.    When the finals of wtt / ott / us open are on ESPN during prime time on a weekend give me a ring.

 

mm didn’t even get a first period takedown in his ncaa finals match fwiw  

 

Edited March 27 by Caveira