lu_alum Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 I've been waiting for my third culture cancellation on here to expire to be able to reply to this thread. Precisely because of these types of contributions that I can add as to why a drunken, spiteful, late night hissy fit that turns access off to those our mods get their feelings hurt by needs to be re-considered. If nothing else, toughen up a little, as we used to say in Minnesota. I'm a bit surprised that no one thought of this rule changer, but over the 25+ years that I've followed college wrestling closely, this one is the ultimate rule change/changer... ...Craig Henning. Craig Henning lost in the NCAA finals in 2007. In 2008, he never even made it out of the conference tournament and the wrestling community said that that will NEVER happen again. So, since 2008, we've had the goofy allocation system in place that allows anyone in the Big 10 and Big 12 to "qualify" for the Big Dance, simply because they're upright and breathing after the conference tournament. Now THAT is a rule changer, friends. Henning entered the B1G tourney as the #5 seed and went 2-and-BBQ, losing on the backside to an unseeded guy from Purdue. Not sure how the coaches could have justified a Wild Card in the back-room discussion. http://www.wrestlingstats.com/big10/pdf/Big%2010-2008.pdfSent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchapman Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 hour ago, Ban Basketball said: I've been waiting for my third culture cancellation on here to expire to be able to reply to this thread. Precisely because of these types of contributions that I can add as to why a drunken, spiteful, late night hissy fit that turns access off to those our mods get their feelings hurt by needs to be re-considered. If nothing else, toughen up a little, as we used to say in Minnesota. I'm a bit surprised that no one thought of this rule changer, but over the 25+ years that I've followed college wrestling closely, this one is the ultimate rule change/changer... ...Craig Henning. Craig Henning lost in the NCAA finals in 2007. In 2008, he never even made it out of the conference tournament and the wrestling community said that that will NEVER happen again. So, since 2008, we've had the goofy allocation system in place that allows anyone in the Big 10 and Big 12 to "qualify" for the Big Dance, simply because they're upright and breathing after the conference tournament. Now THAT is a rule changer, friends. At the time, I believe the B1G was allocated over a total of 70 qualifying spots. So, the B1G decided to make all top 7 placers in each weight class a NC qualifier. Then there were a few spots left over, so it was agreed that the remaining qualifiers would be voted on by the coaches from a pool of 8th place finishers. In 2008, Henning didn't make it to the 7th place match, so he wasn't eligible per B1G rules to be voted in as a qualifier. It wasn't an NCAA rule. Craig Henning got screwed in the 2007 NCAA Finals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juniorvarsity Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Who do we attribute the count from top? There is probably someone else, but Delgado would go down to a single leg from top and rack up riding time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ban Basketball Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 hour ago, lu_alum said: Henning entered the B1G tourney as the #5 seed and went 2-and-BBQ, losing on the backside to an unseeded guy from Purdue. Not sure how the coaches could have justified a Wild Card in the back-room discussion. http://www.wrestlingstats.com/big10/pdf/Big%2010-2008.pdf Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk He'd be in today, for sure. Owner of over two decades of the most dangerous words on the internet! In fact, during the short life of this forum, me's culture has been cancelled three times on this very site! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ban Basketball Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 hour ago, jchapman said: At the time, I believe the B1G was allocated over a total of 70 qualifying spots. So, the B1G decided to make all top 7 placers in each weight class a NC qualifier. Then there were a few spots left over, so it was agreed that the remaining qualifiers would be voted on by the coaches from a pool of 8th place finishers. In 2008, Henning didn't make it to the 7th place match, so he wasn't eligible per B1G rules to be voted in as a qualifier. It wasn't an NCAA rule. I'm not sure if it's the NCAA or not, but I think the new allocation system was a direct result of him not getting out of the tournament. I can remember at the time saying on wrestling forums that that should never happen again. Owner of over two decades of the most dangerous words on the internet! In fact, during the short life of this forum, me's culture has been cancelled three times on this very site! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohio Elite Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 2 minutes ago, Ban Basketball said: I'm not sure if it's the NCAA or not, but I think the new allocation system was a direct result of him not getting out of the tournament. I can remember at the time saying on wrestling forums that that should never happen again. Glad to see you back! 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchapman Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 13 minutes ago, Ban Basketball said: I'm not sure if it's the NCAA or not, but I think the new allocation system was a direct result of him not getting out of the tournament. I can remember at the time saying on wrestling forums that that should never happen again. And what's interesting is the B1G received fewer total allocations in 2009 with the new weight class system of allocations. Funny stuff happened that year, like some weight classes in the Big XII were completely allocated and qualified before the conference tournament. Craig Henning got screwed in the 2007 NCAA Finals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lu_alum Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 (edited) 4 hours ago, Ban Basketball said: I'm not sure if it's the NCAA or not, but I think the new allocation system was a direct result of him not getting out of the tournament. I can remember at the time saying on wrestling forums that that should never happen again. I recall the discussion on the old forum as well. Henning didn't help himself by going from an NCAA finalist to a #5 seed at B1G. Whether Henning was the driver or not, it was generally agreed that we had to do away with the five year rolling average for R12 performance. The era of shady deals was not good. I know the Lehigh forum used to complain about the "Ivy Mob" voting as a block for WCs at the EIWA tourney. Edited February 22 by lu_alum 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ban Basketball Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 (edited) 1 hour ago, lu_alum said: I recall the discussion on the old forum as well. Henning didn't help himself by going from an NCAA finalist to a #5 seed at B1G. Whether Henning was the driver or not, it was generally agreed that we had to do away with the five year rolling average for R12 performance. The era of shady deals was not good. I know the Lehigh forum used to complain about the "Ivy Mob" voting as a block for WCs at the EIWA tourney. It was absolutely the driver. Edited February 22 by Ban Basketball 1 Owner of over two decades of the most dangerous words on the internet! In fact, during the short life of this forum, me's culture has been cancelled three times on this very site! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 Jeff Reese.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lu_alum Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 1 hour ago, Phantom said: Jeff Reese.. among others. very true - and very sad. Reese's former HS coach used to take me to Fall tourneys before he moved from D4 PA to New York. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrestle87 Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 11 hours ago, juniorvarsity said: Who do we attribute the count from top? There is probably someone else, but Delgado would go down to a single leg from top and rack up riding time. There were a ton of dropdown specialists over the years. The number of dudes who got screwed by the rules of their era is unbelievable. If you go back and watch old finals matches, having gotten used to the rules of our era, it’s amazing to see how many guys would have lost by 3 or 4 points in the exact same match just because of the adjustments in stalling calls. I don’t love the 3 point takedown entirely, but I do love the stalling call adjustments. They brought so much spirit back to the sport, especially at the highest level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrestle87 Posted February 22 Share Posted February 22 Also, danger rule…I believe people speculate that goes to dean heil, but it also goes to almost all of gen 1.0 of scramblers, where there was zero confidence to being on your back for 30 seconds in what today would be a 7 point move for the other guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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