Antitroll2828 Posted November 6, 2023 Author Share Posted November 6, 2023 2 hours ago, mspart said: Maybe the question should have been will Yianni make the Olympic Team for 2024? Then people can say their peace on that. Or maybe the question could be who will be our 65KG rep on the Olympic MFS team? Who wants to take on these questions? For myself, I don't see Yianni making the team. He would have to do some major improvement which can be done and a person of his caliber is certainly capable of it. But as has been noted, 65 is super tough. mspart Fair enough, definitely could’ve phrased it differently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AgaveMaria Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 On 11/4/2023 at 8:52 AM, Antitroll2828 said: Is Yianni the most over hyped US wrestler ever? Since he was a sophomore I’ve been hearing how amazing he was at freestyle…hell when he lost 2-0 to Zain then sued a huge portion of the wrestling world was ok with it bc “yianni was our best chance to medal” …meanwhile yianni has taken a lot domestic loses -Zain ,J.O. , Nick lee and multiple Ls to McKenna.. has there ever been a US wrestler this hyped that has taken this many domestic loses Dave Schultz, obviously. He lost 9 times in College and only got 2nd at the Tblisi tournment while in High School even after he pinned Chuck Yagla at the Great Plains Tournament. All those High School and college losses! Then in world competition he got beat a number of times. He only won one world Gold and one Olympic Gold. His own brother Mark won Three world titles - and that is his little brother! Over hyped? How about your post is over the top asinine ” Never attribute to inspiration that which can be adequately explained by delusion”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim L Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 Terrible take by OP.. best interpretation is that YD had not done everything his biggest fans predicted.. yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrestle87 Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 2 hours ago, Antitroll2828 said: get one medal with 0 Russians I understand your point, but it is a little disingenuous bc musukayev, for example, is from russia, as are a number of entrants in most weight classes each year. I checked, and as far as I can tell musukayev was the only russian in yiannis weight that year. This is an interesting topic broadly, but its kind of turning into a thread just bagging on yianni. We have seen a lot of crossover success from strong ncaa performances leading directly to international success, and yianni is one of those guys. Would this thread exist if yianni had beaten nick lee this year but failed to place? He’d still be a 4x champ and silver medalist. Is this just recency speaking? What role did yianni play in vito running roughshod over everyone in the world this year? Certainly greater than zero. I think you are also forgetting the absolute slump that USA wrestling was in for ~15 years starting in 97 and ending with burroughs and varner in 2012. We straight up blew. Sucked. Hot garbage in wrestling shoes. We had some solid performances from individuals, but the average US performance was to get outclassed and shown the door after round 1. So has yianni underperformed against early hopes and excitement, both our and his own, yes. But, he is of heartier, more capable, better prepared stock than the US has produced in a long time. Him underperforming is because we are better, not bc he dropped the ball. Let’s also give some credit to Nick Lee, bc he is nasty in his own right. Dude rose to the occasion. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim L Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 On 11/5/2023 at 12:13 AM, billyhoyle said: Metcalf, Mocco, Schlatter (maybe due to injury in part), Askren All those guys at least made the national team, never did as well Internationally as they did in the NCAAs. Didnt Mocco wrestle for an Olympic bronze? Lots of really good college wrestlers have done less intentionally Pendleton, Kole Conrad, Darion Caldwell all had multiple wins over guys on your list, but never made repped the US at World or Olympic (pretty sure about that) Ed Ruth, one of the most dominant wrestlers of the decade, made 1 national team and didn't place Going old school Pat Smith never made a national team Going really old school, I don't believe Larry Owings did either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bnwtwg Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 This is such a stupid thread. This is why we can’t have nice things. 1 i am an idiot on the internet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 5 hours ago, BigRedFan said: Who is doing that? The initial claim by a certain troll was that people were always saying that Yianni was our best chance to medal, and I and others are pointing out that was exactly true, since it's been seventeen years since anyone other than Yianni won a medal at 65kg, and he did it only last year. And the fact that he's got domestic losses means nothing compared to that fact. It means its going to be tough to make the team in 2024. He may need to transfer to NLWC to have a shot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 54 minutes ago, Jim L said: All those guys at least made the national team, never did as well Internationally as they did in the NCAAs. Didnt Mocco wrestle for an Olympic bronze? Lots of really good college wrestlers have done less intentionally Pendleton, Kole Conrad, Darion Caldwell all had multiple wins over guys on your list, but never made repped the US at World or Olympic (pretty sure about that) Ed Ruth, one of the most dominant wrestlers of the decade, made 1 national team and didn't place Going old school Pat Smith never made a national team Going really old school, I don't believe Larry Owings did either World team. Top 3 is national team. Other than that, you are right on about a lot of things. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 3 hours ago, 1032004 said: wasn't that the year he beat Bajrang at Beat the Streets? I'm pretty sure that was part of what started the "he's our best chance to medal" talk. Some iffy officiating and Bajrang had wrestled on three continents in 10 days or something similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestleknownothing Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 This would have been a Zain Retherford thread a year ago. Perhaps @Antitroll2828 is a little premature on this take. And a little late (Yianni is having a hard time hearing you over his world silver). Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. PeanutButter Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 Perhaps a little more inflammatory than the OP intended but I think I get the drift. After his worlds performance I too was caught very surprised when John lost not once but twice to domestic competition. He might be overhyped or he might be the best prospect (by a small margin) in an unforgiving weightclass. I was recently told that there were, like, a ton of different varieties of tomatoes so I suppose all sorts of pronunciations are welcome. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 I may come off as a Yianni hater, but I am far from that, and I want to clarify. I have friends who know Yianni well and speak to his high character. I would love to YD (or anyone really) win 2024 gold (and then multiple golds going forward.) However, his trend is not great at this point. Could he make the team? Of course. But an argument could be made that he is our #3 guy and is losing ground to a guy who just placed 8th. No number of DQ victories over Muskaev or strangely officiated matches over Bajrang are going to get him on the US team. Also, wasn't the Iranian 5th this year? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gus Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 52 minutes ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said: I may come off as a Yianni hater, but I am far from that, and I want to clarify. I have friends who know Yianni well and speak to his high character. I would love to YD (or anyone really) win 2024 gold (and then multiple golds going forward.) However, his trend is not great at this point. Could he make the team? Of course. But an argument could be made that he is our #3 guy and is losing ground to a guy who just placed 8th. No number of DQ victories over Muskaev or strangely officiated matches over Bajrang are going to get him on the US team. Also, wasn't the Iranian 5th this year? The Iranian was 5th. He lost to Muszukajev and Mamedov. 65kg is deep and these guys all beat each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 21 minutes ago, Gus said: The Iranian was 5th. He lost to Muszukajev and Mamedov. 65kg is deep and these guys all beat each other. I mean, that is how the brackets work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gus Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 20 minutes ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said: I mean, that is how the brackets work. Here is the list of placers from 2018 - present 2018: Otoguro, Bajrang, Valdes/Chakaev 2019: Rashidov, Niyazbekov, Muszukajev/Bajrang 2021: Shakhiev, Yazdani, Osmonov/Tulga 2022: Amouzad, Yianni, Muszukajev/Bajrang 2023: Muszukajev, Riveria, Mamedov/Tevanyan No repeat champions. Only two wrestlers that have placed multiple times: Muszukajev and Bajrang. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 Is Amouzad waiting to go up until after this cycle? He looked bigger this year and the rumblings were that he was having trouble holding the weight. Going up to 74 KG this late might be a pain in the ass, but he has the length to succeed there if he can fill out. I do think it is a bit late... but I do expect him to go to 70 KG after this cycle is over for him with 74 KG for next Olympics. I wouldn't be surprised to see him go 65 KG to 74 KG for 2024 to 2025 much like Yazdani went 74 KG in 2016 to 86 KG in 2017. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 39 minutes ago, Gus said: Here is the list of placers from 2018 - present 2018: Otoguro, Bajrang, Valdes/Chakaev 2019: Rashidov, Niyazbekov, Muszukajev/Bajrang 2021: Shakhiev, Yazdani, Osmonov/Tulga 2022: Amouzad, Yianni, Muszukajev/Bajrang 2023: Muszukajev, Riveria, Mamedov/Tevanyan No repeat champions. Only two wrestlers that have placed multiple times: Muszukajev and Bajrang. Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedFan Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 1 hour ago, Gus said: Here is the list of placers from 2018 - present 2018: Otoguro, Bajrang, Valdes/Chakaev 2019: Rashidov, Niyazbekov, Muszukajev/Bajrang 2021: Shakhiev, Yazdani, Osmonov/Tulga 2022: Amouzad, Yianni, Muszukajev/Bajrang 2023: Muszukajev, Riveria, Mamedov/Tevanyan No repeat champions. Only two wrestlers that have placed multiple times: Muszukajev and Bajrang. That's a crazy statistic. Wonder how that compares to other weight classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gus Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 22 minutes ago, BigRedFan said: That's a crazy statistic. Wonder how that compares to other weight classes. Let's compare with 74kg 2018: Sidakov, Kentchadze, Burroughs/Abdurakhmonov 2019: Sidakov, Chamizo, Kaisanov/Burroughs 2021: Dake, Salkazanov, Bizhoev/Eryilmaz 2022: Dake, Salkazanov, Enami/Demirtas 2023: Sidakov, Dake, Takatani/Tsabolov We had 2 guys repeat as champions in Sidakov and Dake. Additionally, we had 2 others place multiple times in Burroughs (2x) and Salkazanov (2x). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gus Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 51 minutes ago, Gus said: Let's compare with 74kg 2018: Sidakov, Kentchadze, Burroughs/Abdurakhmonov 2019: Sidakov, Chamizo, Kaisanov/Burroughs 2021: Dake, Salkazanov, Bizhoev/Eryilmaz 2022: Dake, Salkazanov, Enami/Demirtas 2023: Sidakov, Dake, Takatani/Tsabolov We had 2 guys repeat as champions in Sidakov and Dake. Additionally, we had 2 others place multiple times in Burroughs (2x) and Salkazanov (2x). 57kg 2018: Uguev, Sanayev, Takahashi/Atli 2019: Uguev, Atli, Dahiya/Sanyev 2021: Gilman, Sarlak, Tsiutryn/Lehr 2022: Abakarov, Gilman, Zanabazar/Micic 2023: Micic, Higuchi, Abakarov/Harutyunyan We have one repeat champion in Uguev (2 gold). We have 5 others that placed multiple times in Sanayev (1 silver, 1 bronze), Atli (1 silver, 1 bronze), Gilman (1 gold, 1 silver), Abakarov ( 1 gold, 1 bronze), Micic (1 gold, 1 bronze). 86kg 2018: DT, Erdin, Friev/Yazdani 2019: Yazdani, Punia, Naifonov/Reichmuth 2021: Yazdani, DT, Abakarov/Naifonov 2022: DT, Yazdani, Dauletbekov/Makojev 2023: DT, Yazdani, Dauletbekov/Amine We had 2 guys repeat as champs in Yazdani (2 gold, 2 silver, 1 bronze) and DT (3 gold, 1 silver). 2 others place multiple times in Naifonov (2 bronze) & Dauletbekov (2 bronze). 97kg 2018: Sadulaev, Snyder, Odikadze/Conyedo 2019: Sadulaev, Sharifov, Nurov/Snyder 2021: Sadulaev, Snyder, Goleij/Zakariiev 2022: Snyder, Tsakulov, Magomedov/Matcharashvili 2023: Tazhudinov, Magodedov, Matcharashvili/Synder We have one three-peat champion in Sadulaev. 3 others placed multiple times in Snyder (1 gold, 2 silver, 2 bronze), Magomedov (1 silver, 1 bronze), Matcharachvili (2 bronze). 125kg 2018: Petriashvili, Deng, Hadi/Gwiazdowski 2019: Petriashvili, Akgul, Deng/Khotsianivski 2021: Zare, Petriashvili, Lkhagvagerel/Akgul 2022: Akgul, Lkhagvagerel, Petriashvili/Zare 2023: Zare, Petriashvili, Akgul/Parris We have two repeat champs in Petriashvili (2 gold, 2 silver, 1 bronze) and Zare (2 gold, 1 bronze). 3 others placed multiple times in Deng (1 silver, 1 bronze), Akgul (1 gold, 1 silver, 2 bronze) & Lkhagvegerel (1 silver, 1 bronze). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestleknownothing Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 4 hours ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said: I may come off as a Yianni hater, but I am far from that, and I want to clarify. I have friends who know Yianni well and speak to his high character. I would love to YD (or anyone really) win 2024 gold (and then multiple golds going forward.) However, his trend is not great at this point. Could he make the team? Of course. But an argument could be made that he is our #3 guy and is losing ground to a guy who just placed 8th. No number of DQ victories over Muskaev or strangely officiated matches over Bajrang are going to get him on the US team. Also, wasn't the Iranian 5th this year? Lee was 7th, not 8th. But not the 7th best wrestler there. See Repechage is French for Stupid. 1 Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 3 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said: Lee was 7th, not 8th. But not the 7th best wrestler there. See Repechage is French for Stupid. Would you have him somewhere around 4th best? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestleknownothing Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 2 minutes ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said: Would you have him somewhere around 4th best? Yes Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interviewed_at_Weehawken Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 11 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said: Lee was 7th, not 8th. But not the 7th best wrestler there. See Repechage is French for Stupid. If only there was a way to earn seeding points and separate yourself from other studs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestleknownothing Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 5 minutes ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said: If only there was a way to earn seeding points and separate yourself from other studs! I have expounded on the un-serious way they set up the seeding points. Have all the tournaments in the most difficult to get to time zones for the western hemisphere. If they show, they have two choices: get there a week early, ala the world championships, to acclimate and optimize performance (and spend loads of money - see point 2); get there just in time, and feel like crap, and maybe get hurt. Have the points accumulate individually so that a deep country, like the US, will have to spend a crazy amount sending multiple wrestlers, but PR can just send the one that they know is their rep. Make it a perfect attendance award rather than merit, because attendance lines their pockets, not achievement. Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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