Paniro Johnson Is a God...

[Corby]

48 minutes ago, fishbane said:

Expanding on this the criminal complaint says that the criminal conduct happened "on or between the dates 8/25/2021 and 10/31/2022."

https://htv-prod-media.s3.amazonaws.com/files/redacted-johnson-64c995095e416.pdf

The year he was a gray shirt so the NCAA wouldn't be able to punish him

[fishbane]

10 minutes ago, Corby said:

The year he was a gray shirt so the NCAA wouldn't be able to punish him

Fall semester started 8/22/2022.  So if any of this occured between 8/22/2022 and 10/31/2022, which is possible based on the timeline (8/25/2021-10/31/2022) in the complaint, then that may not been the case.

He may have also been enrolled for summer classes or something.

Edited August 2, 2023 by fishbane

[flyingcement]

I hope it's somehow not as extreme as has been reported.  I would like to see him wrestle again and would hope a young man could get a second chance after something like this.

Personally I am way more forgiving of gambling crimes and drug crimes than I am about domestic violence or sexually motivated crimes.  

[boconnell]

4 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Insider trading laws in the US are different than they are elsewhere, and are a little weird. And, yes, sometimes victimless.

You don't see a defense of insider trading everyday.

[boconnell]

1 hour ago, flyingcement said:

I hope it's somehow not as extreme as has been reported.  I would like to see him wrestle again and would hope a young man could get a second chance after something like this.

Personally I am way more forgiving of gambling crimes and drug crimes than I am about domestic violence or sexually motivated crimes.  

Legally I would definitely agree.  

But I think in a sporting context, it's okay to take sporting issues more seriously than non-sporting ones.  This is why the suspensions for PEDs are always more severe than the suspensions for domestic violence.  And not much destroys sports more than athletes gambling with insider info.  It may be far less immoral, but it is far more dangerous to sports.

[billyhoyle]

4 hours ago, Corby said:

The year he was a gray shirt so the NCAA wouldn't be able to punish him

This is interesting. If all the ISU bets were prior to being an ncaa athlete he may be off the hook- unless some were done with inside info through affiliations among the athletes. In that case, ISU still might kick him out. 

[1032004]

2 hours ago, billyhoyle said:

This is interesting. If all the ISU bets were prior to being an ncaa athlete he may be off the hook- unless some were done with inside info through affiliations among the athletes. In that case, ISU still might kick him out. 

Weirdly the complaint says he “was a wrestler during the 2021-2022” season…but he wasn’t.

[Wrestleknownothing]

28 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Weirdly the complaint says he “was a wrestler during the 2021-2022” season…but he wasn’t.

Saw that too. Is it possible that our understanding (or theirs) of "gray shirt" is incomplete?

[1032004]

33 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Saw that too. Is it possible that our understanding (or theirs) of "gray shirt" is incomplete?

I was surprised his page on the ISU roster even says he grayshirted…I thought it was technically an “unofficial” term and you’re not even enrolled when grayshirting?

[BobDole]

I'm more interesting how he had $40k to gamble during that year, that's quite a bit of money for a 19 year old kid.

[nhs67]

20 minutes ago, BobDole said:

I'm more interesting how he had $40k to gamble during that year, that's quite a bit of money for a 19 year old kid.

It all starts with $5...

As Willie stated... A GOD.

[Husker_Du]

13 hours ago, Caveira said:

When I spill the beans.  I always spill the beans from my confidential informants immediately.      So then can I go to some message board to spill the beans like 8 mins later…. That way my sources trust me more and give me more info later.     Naming the source is also good in this process.  
 

anyone hear about Aj Ferrari or gable going to Iowa ?

except the 'informant' is kevin dresser, and is not 'confidential'

try harder weirdo. 

[Wrestleknownothing]

47 minutes ago, BobDole said:

I'm more interesting how he had $40k to gamble during that year, that's quite a bit of money for a 19 year old kid.

He did not have $40k to gamble. The complaint says he made 1,283 wagers for $45,640, or $35.57 per bet. What had too much of was time. That is almost 3 bets per day for 16 straight months.

[juniorvarsity]

10 hours ago, fishbane said:

Expanding on this the criminal complaint says that the criminal conduct happened "on or between the dates 8/25/2021 and 10/31/2022."

https://htv-prod-media.s3.amazonaws.com/files/redacted-johnson-64c995095e416.pdf

This is my thought. His first college match was on 11/5 and he was in grey shirt the prior year. So the rules/laws may not apply given the time period. 

[ionel]

5 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

He did not have $40k to gamble. The complaint says he made 1,283 wagers for $45,640, or $35.57 per bet. What had too much of was time. That is almost 3 bets per day for 16 straight months.

Isn't there an ad showing Barry Sanders giving betting advice on his phone while playing pickle ball?  Multi-task, let's say a wrestler pulled out the Draft King app every time he checked weight on the scales, how much time would it take?

[Wrestleknownothing]

3 minutes ago, juniorvarsity said:

This is my thought. His first college match was on 11/5 and he was in grey shirt the prior year. So the rules/laws may not apply given the time period. 

The laws would apply (under aged, hiding behind another's identity, failing to pay taxes, etc.) and I imagine there are rules against breaking the law.

[Wrestleknownothing]

3 minutes ago, ionel said:

Isn't there an ad showing Barry Sanders giving betting advice on his phone while playing pickle ball?  Multi-task, let's say a wrestler pulled out the Draft King app every time he checked weight on the scales, how much time would it take?

Oh, I know the gambling industry wants you to gamble at least three times a day and to take your advice from someone playing pickleball who does not understand what the question is, but try doing anything other than eating three times a day for eighteen straight months. It is very hard to do.

[Husker_Du]

3 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

The laws would apply (under aged, hiding behind another's identity, failing to pay taxes, etc.) and I imagine there are rules against breaking the law.

correct. but that doesn't necessarily put him out of compliance w/ the NCAA (the way i understand it).

[Dogbone]

Not sure why Dresser would be upset with DMR.  All they did was report criminal charges, which were public.   It's possible Paniro's name were not known by the NCAA, and Dresser, since he was (alleged) to have been using someone else's account or disguising his account.   But the criminal charges appear to be real, but hopefully can be beat and Paniro can be proven innocent.

The complaint states some of the bets were made on his personal iPhone in areas not available to the public.  So if this all occurred before he was a student the question is how will the NCAA treat a prospective student who has access the facilities betting on University property and other ISU events?

I do not know the rules, but I would guess the prospective (underage) student gambling on ISU events could be a problem.

Hopefully not. 

 

[Wrestleknownothing]

8 minutes ago, Husker_Du said:

correct. but that doesn't necessarily put him out of compliance w/ the NCAA (the way i understand it).

Let's hope so. I find this whole thing silly and hypocritical. 

[Gantry]

26 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

He did not have $40k to gamble. The complaint says he made 1,283 wagers for $45,640, or $35.57 per bet. What had too much of was time. That is almost 3 bets per day for 16 straight months.

Given the high number, maybe he was placing bets for other people not of age.  

[TylerDurden]

13 hours ago, MizzouFan01 said:

Not saying this isn’t the facts, could be why Swederski has said publicly that he will be at 149 this year. 

Swiderski needs to be at 149 because he is too big to make 141 regularly...but this situation with Johnson makes it a bit simpler to sort out in the room, I'd guess. 

[TylerDurden]

56 minutes ago, Gantry said:

Given the high number, maybe he was placing bets for other people not of age.  

I don't personally gamble on apps, but placing bets quickly and almost unconsciously is part of the design. They make it very, very easy to place wagers. I'm not saying 1,283 doesn't seem like a large number of wagers over the time period for most people, but placing that many bets via an app that you can access 24 hours a day isn't the most noteworthy thing in the complaint. 

[juniorvarsity]

33 minutes ago, Dogbone said:

Not sure why Dresser would be upset with DMR.  All they did was report criminal charges, which were public.   It's possible Paniro's name were not known by the NCAA, and Dresser, since he was (alleged) to have been using someone else's account or disguising his account.   But the criminal charges appear to be real, but hopefully can be beat and Paniro can be proven innocent.

The complaint states some of the bets were made on his personal iPhone in areas not available to the public.  So if this all occurred before he was a student the question is how will the NCAA treat a prospective student who has access the facilities betting on University property and other ISU events?

I do not know the rules, but I would guess the prospective (underage) student gambling on ISU events could be a problem.

Hopefully not. 

 

It is an interesting situation about how the NCAA can handle prospective athletes with a situation like this(assuming he falls into the category due to gray shirt). NCAA compliance is not the same as the law. I am very curious about the time period of the criminal complaint ending on 10/31 and how he wrestled his first match on 11/5.

If what Dresser is telling Willie is accurate and they expect no penalty, then my guess is he signed some sort of compliance paperwork declaring himself a college athlete before 10/31 and making him subject to NCAA regulations, however he decided to stop the gambling activities once he signed. This would mean he could dodge the NCAA compliance penalties. He never signed anything his gray shirt year.

[fishbane]

1 hour ago, juniorvarsity said:

This is my thought. His first college match was on 11/5 and he was in grey shirt the prior year. So the rules/laws may not apply given the time period. 

Would 11/5 be the relevant date though?  I assume he is on some amount of athletic scholarship.  He would have been on campus taking classes courtesy of the athletic department starting 8/22.  

Certainly some NCAA rules reach back before enrollment.  I don't know when gambling becomes prohibited by the NCAA.  When the recruit signs their letter of intent?  When the recruit enrolls?  When they first start classes (~8/2022)?  When they start official practices (~10/2022)?  When they first compete officially 11/5?

My instinct is that it must be before the first competition.