TampaTiger Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 Is there a battle brewing between Harman and Hawks? I want to poll and see who everyone thinks the starter will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 2 hours ago, TampaTiger said: Is there a battle brewing between Harman and Hawks? I want to poll and see who everyone thinks the starter will be. I think for the season it will be Harman. Unless Harman starts struggling by continuously losing to guys he should.be beating or gets hurt, there is no reason to turn to Hawkes. The caveat there is that Hawkes still has a redshirt to use unless he wants to go. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mhlm Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 Does Hawks have a redshirt? I thought he used that last year - he wrestled unattached and early in the season that’s what we were told was the plan. And if so, then they could wrestle both of them depending on how they think they would match up. I spoke to someone yesterday that mentioned they were sending Harman to ASU and Hawks to the Lindenwood Open. Hawks hasn’t wrestled much outside of teammates since the Mo Valley Open last year, so this was a way to get him several matches before getting him some time in the lineup and seeing where that plays out. The backlog at 184 is a good problem to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 I was using Wrestlestat, but obviously it is not an authority on the matter: https://www.wrestlestat.com/wrestler/62375/hawks-colton/profile "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 (edited) I think Hawkes and Whiting are the 184lbers for next season w/ Harman at 174 again. Mocco down to 157 with Jacques gone. Eh... Not 'think' as much as 'hope' I guess. Edited November 14, 2022 by nhs67 "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mhlm Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 Yes, wrestlestat is weird. We're friends of the family - the Hawks', so a bit of the information I provided is from them. While more was said, 1 - not my place to share, 2 - sometimes coaches say one thing and then things end up completely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mhlm Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 25 minutes ago, Mhlm said: Yes, wrestlestat is weird. We're friends of the family - the Hawks', so a bit of the information I provided is from them. While more was said, 1 - not my place to share, 2 - sometimes coaches say one thing and then things end up completely different. I guess I should've clarified - the info I provided was where they were planning on sending each one this week. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 Well Hawkes/Harman - Montalvo lacks a bit of luster after seeing what Saldano did to Montalvo. If Harman doesn't win comfortably and Hawkes os not on shirt, they should consider him in the lineup. He is a bit thicker so the brutes won't be as brutalizing. 1 "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudge Tunnel Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 2 hours ago, nhs67 said: I think Hawkes and Whiting are the 184lbers for next season w/ Harman at 174 again. Mocco down to 157 with Jacques gone. Eh... Not 'think' as much as 'hope' I guess. Mocco to 157?!?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 5 minutes ago, Fudge Tunnel said: Mocco to 157?!?! He would be 165 if O'Toole wasn't there. O'Toole would have been 157 as a frosh had they not had Jacques there then as well. Without Jacques there is a hole at 157. Askren has said multiple times on FRL that Mocco doesn't cut for 174. That tells me he is close enough that an offseason spent around adjusting down might not just be beneficial for the team but for him. They don't need him at 174 now. If he hasn't grown to the weight by now, he isn't going to. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestej Posted November 24, 2022 Share Posted November 24, 2022 On 11/14/2022 at 8:20 AM, nhs67 said: I think Hawkes and Whiting are the 184lbers for next season w/ Harman at 174 again. Mocco down to 157 with Jacques gone. Eh... Not 'think' as much as 'hope' I guess. Zero chance Mocco ever sees 157. Hell two years ago he was at 165 and O’Toole was 157 for less than a month and both bumped up to where they are now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 24, 2022 Share Posted November 24, 2022 Just now, Wrestej said: Zero chance Mocco ever sees 157. Hell two years ago he was at 165 and O’Toole was 157 for less than a month and both bumped up to where they are now. Then maybe they swap? He just isn't a 174lber. As I said.. I HOPE it happens, not that I think it will. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestej Posted November 24, 2022 Share Posted November 24, 2022 On 11/14/2022 at 8:20 AM, nhs67 said: I think Hawkes and Whiting are the 184lbers for next season w/ Harman at 174 again. Mocco down to 157 with Jacques gone. Eh... Not 'think' as much as 'hope' I guess. Zero chance Mocco ever sees 157. Hell two years ago he was at 165 and O’Toole was 157 for less than a month and both bumped up to where they are now. 12 minutes ago, nhs67 said: Then maybe they swap? He just isn't a 174lber. As I said.. I HOPE it happens, not that I think it will. I think he has grown into the weight pretty well. He never looks undersized in comparison to his competition. I thought he beat Lewis last year but they didn’t award 2 at end of regulation. Ended up losing in sudden victory. Tells me he’s right there with the top in the weight class. He hasn’t seen 157 since 3 years ago and that year ended in November for him, tore up his knee in route to his victory over Carr. Happened right in front of me. Felt awful for him but he gutted out the rest of the match and held on to win. If all goes right at Championships I think he can AA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 25, 2022 Share Posted November 25, 2022 I disagree on the size part, but agree on the rest - for the most part. He looks like he could easily make 165. Hidlay last year looked thicker than he did, and he was one season removed from 157. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestej Posted November 25, 2022 Share Posted November 25, 2022 2 hours ago, nhs67 said: I disagree on the size part, but agree on the rest - for the most part. He looks like he could easily make 165. Hidlay last year looked thicker than he did, and he was one season removed from 157. O’Toole isn’t going down for Mocco to wrestle 165. No way is Mocco sucking to 157. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 25, 2022 Share Posted November 25, 2022 4 minutes ago, Wrestej said: O’Toole isn’t going down for Mocco to wrestle 165. No way is Mocco sucking to 157. If you read what I said was that perhaps they swap, then. Meaning O'Toole going 174. Unfortunately both are 165lbers. I maintain my initial statement. I hope he goes down to 157. If he can make 165 now, which looks obvious to me - he isn't close to a full 174lber, then an offseason of training and adjusting to get to 157 isn't insane. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestej Posted November 25, 2022 Share Posted November 25, 2022 He is cutting to get to 174 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 25, 2022 Share Posted November 25, 2022 I mean... so what? What does that change about anything I said? Most of the top 165lbers now would cut to make 174 were they not eating peas and carrots, or whatever Beyonce said. He won't contend at 174 because the top 174lbers are true 174lbers. He has the skill to compete with just about anyone, but he won't make it through that slog unscathed. If he adjusts his diet and starts heading down properly and immediately after the season, he will be right there contending for a NC - at 157lbs - next season. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestej Posted November 25, 2022 Share Posted November 25, 2022 I get it you would like Mocco to drop. I would like to win lottery. Odds are probably similar for both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 4 hours ago, Wrestej said: I get it you would like Mocco to drop. I would like to win lottery. Odds are probably similar for both. You have absolutely zero data to reinforce that sort of statement. Now you are just being silly. Mr. Askren has eluded to it being what he should do several times on FRL over the last couple/few years. Are you closer to the situation than him? Back to the original subject at hand: If Mocco were to go 157 it would make sense to have Harman go 174 and Whiting and Hawkes battle it out at 184 from next year on. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestej Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 13 minutes ago, nhs67 said: You have absolutely zero data to reinforce that sort of statement. Now you are just being silly. Mr. Askren has eluded to it being what he should do several times on FRL over the last couple/few years. Are you closer to the situation than him? Back to the original subject at hand: If Mocco were to go 157 it would make sense to have Harman go 174 and Whiting and Hawkes battle it out at 184 from next year on. Tell you what the next time I’m there I’ll ask Brian and let you know what he says. That good for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 50 minutes ago, Wrestej said: Tell you what the next time I’m there I’ll ask Brian and let you know what he says. That good for you Actually yes. Absolutely. Please do. Make sure you emphasize the guy on the BBS never said he thought that was what would happen, just that he hopes it would. Because Mocco would contend there next season. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestej Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 24 minutes ago, nhs67 said: Actually yes. Absolutely. Please do. Make sure you emphasize the guy on the BBS never said he thought that was what would happen, just that he hopes it would. Because Mocco would contend there next season. Will do 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhs67 Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 (edited) 13 hours ago, Wrestej said: Will do Do you think Whiting or Hawkes will be at 197 for a year after Elam or do you expect Sinclair to step right in after Redshirt? Also, 157 next year? You thinking Mauller? Edited November 26, 2022 by nhs67 "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestej Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 Those are all good questions. There is some good talent at 157 in the room. Would like to see how Steed develops, plus Fisher and Gioffre are tough but need to take another step. Mauller wrestled 157 last year but I thought he was small. Whiting has great positioning but needs to work on attacks. Sinclair is a stud but I have not seen him go so I can’t give any thoughts in honesty. Depends on his transition to the next level. Cliché I know, but some can make the jump and others it takes awhile. Hawks I would love see get a shot at 184. Any of our 184 guys going up by next year are going to be undersized. More to ask coach, see if he will give any insight. There’s always a plan but you well know in wrestling lots can happen. Thinks don’t always shake out how we would like. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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