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Shilson v Mortimer head bounce


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She shouldn't have to change,  she should have been using proper defense already.  There isn't a lot to do from there,  but doing nothing will hurt the most. When you've already given up the undertook you need to get your elbow down. Having your elbow back glued to your lat is to keep them out of the underhook.

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11 minutes ago, MPhillips said:

If it was illegal/dangerous/brutal why wasn't it stopped after the first bounce or not called immediately after the second? Is the qualifier that, she was knocked out?  Not being cantankerous here.

The fact that she was knocked out by those two bounces would warrant a long look at the video.
That's not a common occurrence at this level of competition.

In the video review, I think it looks like it was intentional.

The refs at the tournament came to the same conclusion.
The takedown was revoked and points removed from Mortimer.

See also, Vayle Baker's headbutt that got her DQd from the tournament.

Edited by Mike Parrish
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30 minutes ago, Dark Energy said:

Was the move done with the express purpose of threatening or causing a serious head injury in order for the opposing wrestler to release a legal hold?  

No but neither was the other. Stretch bounce and go behind. Basic front head position. 

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Just now, El Luchador said:

No but neither was the other. Stretch bounce and go behind. Basic front head position. 

So what is your guess as to why all four refs came to the same conclusion and DQ'd Mortimer from the tournament?
It can only be from the Brutality clause in the rules.

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Just now, El Luchador said:

No but neither was the other. Stretch bounce and go behind. Basic front head position. 

It clearly was … hard head slam.  Another hard head slam.  Done with intent to at least threaten injury so as to get opponent to release hold.  Not ok.

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7 minutes ago, El Luchador said:

He is awful. He has botched matches bad. I'm not getting into it but he is bad.

Fair enough.
Welcome to women's wrestling, where the refs are terrible and the parents scream at the screen.

I have my own list of women's refs who should never, ever, ever be allowed to ref another match.

 

I give you the most cringey moment.

The center ref overruled the Trackwrestling tiebreaker criteria and Mike Jones filed his one and only challenge of his coaching career.

https://www.flowrestling.org/articles/5061169-they-re-wrestled-a-semifinal-at-wcwa-nationals
 

Edited by Mike Parrish
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Just now, El Luchador said:

He has done sr. mens matches too. He's likable enough but he has had some significant f ups.

Then have a beer with him, but don't let him ref.

Young refs usually get better, but if you're on your 5th year of reffing or later and you're still screwing the pooch on a regular basis, stop disrespecting the athletes and become a pairing official or something.

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16 hours ago, Dark Energy said:

@uncle bernardyour logic has tremendous holes.  Pretty much no move would be illegal.  Opponent just needs to defend themselves.  Easy as that.  Stop being a wus.  

No actually your logic would make many basic moves illegal. There are moves that are illegal because they put wrestlers in dangerous positions that aren't defensible. Getting snapped in a front headlock position isn't one of them.

You should be arguing that half nelsons are illegal. If my opponent doesn't turn - like Shilson doesn't defend herself - I will rip their arm off. That should be illegal.

15 hours ago, mspart said:

I have to say I have never seen anyone do that in any match I've been in or have watched.   I would call that slamming and not part of wrestling.  I was crossfaced once in veterans competition that was pretty brutal, I almost went out.   I was stunned and really couldn't wrestle for a little while, and as a result lost pretty bad. 

mspart

It's true that you rarely see something like that because it's incredibly difficult to snap someone so effectively. Mortimer is being punished for being good at the move. 

Here's a fact: If Shilson doesn't go out, nobody would have given that sequence a second thought, including the officials who didn't stop it until they realized she was out.

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I’m not saying what you say I’m saying.  Here is what I’m saying … a move whose sole purpose is to threaten or cause injury so as to get a wrestler to release a grip is not ok. I’m being very specific.

on top of that, let’s be more specific — a move whose sole purpose is to threaten or cause a head injury so as to get a wrestler to release a grip, is not ok.

I don’t care if the potentially injured wrestler could figure out a way to defend.   We are talking about intent and potential harm.  
 

This is not hard.  And I don’t care if people were trained to do this.  Head injuries are a big deal.  The sport is doing more to prevent them.  
 

A move SPECIFICALLY designed to cause a head injury if the defending wrestler isn’t quick or wise enough to defend it —- is NOT ok.   

This is pretty simple.

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And on the point that the match would not have been stopped if she didn’t go unconscious … you are likely right.  

Which is also not ok.  Doing a move … 2 times, which purposefully aims to injure … and only giving a moderate concussion … is still unacceptable.

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