RYou Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 9 hours ago, Jason Bryant said: Here's how I came to my conclusion. I didn't include the raw numbers because, well, it's not as pretty. How about deleting the total wins column since the value is more related to school scheduling which is out the hands of the wrestler. I doubt it makes much of a difference in the ranking, but lets omit factors a wrestler can't control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RYou Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 9 hours ago, GreatWhiteNorth said: Couldn't agree more. Using the word "considerations" would clear up a lot of confusion. (But note that the word 'criteria' - strictly speaking - isn't actually used incorrectly. It's confusing because it is used in a different way than it is typically used in the wrestling world. Example - Your 'criteria' for a new truck could = fast, corners well, comfortable, seats 4, heavy duty towing, heavy duty payload, 4x8 bed, heated front seats. That is 'criteria', but it isn't definitive enough to actually select the best truck. To do that, you'd have to put the considerations in a defined order.) Ah, but your "considerstions" thus become your criteria for your decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestleknownothing Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 24 minutes ago, RYou said: How about deleting the total wins column since the value is more related to school scheduling which is out the hands of the wrestler. I doubt it makes much of a difference in the ranking, but lets omit factors a wrestler can't control. I think that is less true than it used to be. Cael Sanderson said in an interview that he was letting veterans choose when they wresled. And there was talk on here of Yianni skipping an early season tournament because of its proximity to a freestyle event. Those are just two examples, but I suspect it is more common. Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmoney Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 19 hours ago, TylerDurden said: Over his career, that's probably true. Every win in the semis and final is over another All-American (that's eight without doing anything else). Guys you beat in the quarters have some work to do on the back side and those who he beat in the first/second rounds have to win a ton to make AA. I may take a look at this and put a list together to see who the other seven were. If I recall correctly he defeated some monsters every round his freshman year. Huge upsets announcers were shocked or at least mesmerized he was defeating guys in quarterfinals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Bryant Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 When you have to determine something between candidates who are close, you pick nits. In an era of ducking matches, I used this metric as a measure for this graphic to show he put it on the line more than anyone else. He wrestled every available match. If everyone had within a reasonable spread, I wouldn’t have used it. In some cases, Parris had almost double as some candidates. That doesn’t imply everyone ducked, but just another data point. As everyone knows, there are lies, damn lies and statistics. 2 Insert catchy tagline here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idaho Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 8 hours ago, ionel said: A potato fork?! @Idaho would be proud. No i used a shovel. Sure a pitchfork worked when dry but not for the fresh wet shit. Sponsored by INTERMAT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WrestlingRasta Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 2 hours ago, RYou said: How about deleting the total wins column since the value is more related to school scheduling which is out the hands of the wrestler. I doubt it makes much of a difference in the ranking, but lets omit factors a wrestler can't control. Then quality of competition goes out the window. So now we can’t factor how many wins, how many pins/bonus, or quality of competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headshuck Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 So if I get this right, we’re voting on a guy with zero pins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestleknownothing Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 14 hours ago, CHROMEBIRD said: I don't understand why they did this. Isn't the finalist pool usually around 5 or so candidates? I have finalists in quotation marks because in the early years they did not always list who was a finalist, just who won. Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Cinnabon Posted March 23, 2023 Author Share Posted March 23, 2023 2 hours ago, RYou said: How about deleting the total wins column since the value is more related to school scheduling which is out the hands of the wrestler. I doubt it makes much of a difference in the ranking, but lets omit factors a wrestler can't control. No way in hell Yianni finishes 5th in Hodge Voting. At worst he'll be 2nd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headshuck Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 If Spencer had pinned his way back to third, he’d be a great candidate. Pin or be pinned trying is a better look for Hodge than career achievement. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribers Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 Did yanni win yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ionel Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, scribers said: Did yanni win yet? who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ionel Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 29 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said: No way in hell Yianni finishes 5th in Hodge Voting. At worst he'll be 2nd. but what about the GOAT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribers Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 They pigeonholed this award from the onset that pretends to award the clearly most dominating best wrestler.. Kinda like the same people making the team score as it is at season ending tournament and can't figure out why it isn't interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribers Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 12 hours ago, Jason Bryant said: Here's how I came to my conclusion. I didn't include the raw numbers because, well, it's not as pretty. Who had the most pinfalls? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Bryant Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 4 minutes ago, scribers said: Who had the most pinfalls? Haven't been able to find any stats related to their off-the-mat bowling history. If you find it, I'll include that, too. 2 3 Insert catchy tagline here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestleknownothing Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 16 minutes ago, Jason Bryant said: Haven't been able to find any stats related to their off-the-mat bowling history. If you find it, I'll include that, too. Pin? Fall? Pinfall. One term to rule them all. 1 Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scourge165 Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 I almost want to vote for Vito just for what he did in the Semi's and Finals...but it should be Parris. Even if Kerkvliet wrestled with all the urgency of a trust fund kid looking for a job... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbane Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 4 hours ago, headshuck said: Hodge finished his college career with a record of 46-0 and 36 pins. So he must have had 14 his junior year if your stats are correct. Percentage overall was 78%. Below is his full record from his entry in the Hall of Fame. In my previous post I included his pin stats from his junior year. He had 11 not 14. Hodge had 10 pins as a sophomore, 11 as a junior, but after not winning a Hodge Trophy two straight years he stepped it up and got more than a dozen (15) his senior year. Sadly he still did not win the Hodge Trophy. You did have the correct number of falls for his career (10+11+15). 5 hours ago, headshuck said: Also from NCAA.com: “In all three of his NCAA finals appearances, he pinned his opponent; twice he pinned his way through the entire tournament” The NCAA tournament was only 4 to 5 matches back in the old days. He obviously did not pin at the same rate outside of the tournament. Or do you expect that the stats from the HOF are incorrect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbane Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 Mason Parris is leading the fan vote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headshuck Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 Hodge didn’t win the Hodge? Next you’ll be telling me Heisman didn’t win a Heisman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbane Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 14 hours ago, Jason Bryant said: Here's how I came to my conclusion. I didn't include the raw numbers because, well, it's not as pretty. You didn't include raw numbers. Are the numbers supposed to be rank? If so, isn't there an error in the falls column? Parris is 1, Alirez is 2, there is no 3, then you have 2 wrestlers ranked 4 (O'Connor and O'Toole). Shouldn't O'Toole and O'Connor both be ranked 3 and not 4? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragit Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 1. Parris 2. O'Connor and Alirez (tie) No other strong contenders. Parris should win. Undefeated, thoroughly dominated a very challenging weight class with a very diverse group of opponents, lots of pins. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHROMEBIRD Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 9 hours ago, Le duke said: I have family near Greeley, in Fort Collins. It’s the feed lots. Any time the wind shifts to being from an eastern direction, a lot of the Front Range towns get hit with the Greeley scent. Plenty of afternoons in Loveland and Fort Collins have been scented with the Odour d’Greeley. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk The "dairy air" as we called it... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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