Another US resident supposedly popped for anti-doping violation

[LJB]

1 hour ago, mspart said:

He knew the risks.   Whether pot should or shouldn't be illegal, is not the issue.   It is illegal to use.   Therefore, he was not too serious about being in competition or is addicted and can't stop.  Either way it is a problem.

mspart

no one is addicted to marijuana...

not anymore than anyone is addicted to cheeseburgers anyway...

but the point is concrete...

the rules are the rules no matter what your own personal feelings may or may not be...

want to compete then follow them...

[mspart]

https://nida.nih.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-addictive

Marijuana use disorders are often associated with dependence—in which a person feels withdrawal symptoms when not taking the drug. People who use marijuana frequently often report irritability, mood and sleep difficulties, decreased appetite, cravings, restlessness, and/or various forms of physical discomfort that peak within the first week after quitting and last up to 2 weeks.^20,21 Marijuana dependence occurs when the brain adapts to large amounts of the drug by reducing production of and sensitivity to its own endocannabinoid neurotransmitters.

https://www.cdc.gov/marijuana/health-effects/addiction.html

Some people who use marijuana will develop marijuana use disorder, meaning that they are unable to stop using marijuana even though it’s causing health and social problems in their lives.

• One study estimated that approximately 3 in 10 people who use marijuana have marijuana use disorder.¹
• Another study estimated that people who use cannabis have about a 10% likelihood of becoming addicted.²
• The risk of developing marijuana use disorder is greater in people who start using marijuana during youth or adolescence and who use marijuana more frequently.³

Say again?

I disagree with your first two points.   Agree with your last 3 points. 

mspart

 

 

[LJB]

3 minutes ago, mspart said:

https://nida.nih.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-addictive

Marijuana use disorders are often associated with dependence—in which a person feels withdrawal symptoms when not taking the drug. People who use marijuana frequently often report irritability, mood and sleep difficulties, decreased appetite, cravings, restlessness, and/or various forms of physical discomfort that peak within the first week after quitting and last up to 2 weeks.^20,21 Marijuana dependence occurs when the brain adapts to large amounts of the drug by reducing production of and sensitivity to its own endocannabinoid neurotransmitters.

https://www.cdc.gov/marijuana/health-effects/addiction.html

Some people who use marijuana will develop marijuana use disorder, meaning that they are unable to stop using marijuana even though it’s causing health and social problems in their lives.

• One study estimated that approximately 3 in 10 people who use marijuana have marijuana use disorder.¹
• Another study estimated that people who use cannabis have about a 10% likelihood of becoming addicted.²
• The risk of developing marijuana use disorder is greater in people who start using marijuana during youth or adolescence and who use marijuana more frequently.³

Say again?

I disagree with your first two points.   Agree with your last 3 points. 

mspart

 

 

no one becomes physically addicted to marijuana...

"use disorder" is a an example of a buzz word created to alleviate responsibility...

 

i really like my morning spicy noodles... same breakfast every morning... when i run out or can't get it i get annoyed and unhappy and edgy and sometimes i get a real grumpy look on my face for the rest of the day...

am i addicted to ramen?

 

[LJB]

Marijuana use can lead to the development of problem use, known as a marijuana use disorder, which takes the form of addiction in severe cases.

 

no one has to take responsibility for anything anymore...

[mspart]

1 hour ago, LJB said:

Marijuana use can lead to the development of problem use, known as a marijuana use disorder, which takes the form of addiction in severe cases.

 

no one has to take responsibility for anything anymore...

Would you say the same for a heroin addict or fentanyl addict?   They have a use disorder that takes the form of addiction.  Granted pot is not as addictive as those other two, but addiction is dependence and dependence is addiction.  When you are dependent, you are physically addicted.   Yes you are responsible for it but it is addiction just the same. 

mspart

[Mike Parrish]

5 minutes ago, mspart said:

Would you say the same for a heroin addict or fentanyl addict?   They have a use disorder that takes the form of addiction.  Granted pot is not as addictive as those other two, but addiction is dependence and dependence is addiction.  When you are dependent, you are physically addicted.   Yes you are responsible for it but it is addiction just the same. 

mspart

I'd compare pot to caffeine in terms of addiction persistence.

Unpleasant to stop using, but nowhere near strong opiates.
Not in the same universe.

[LJB]

absolutely not... 

opiates are actually physically addictive...

marijuana is not physically addictive...

just because you are obese and weak and don't want to stop eating cheeseburgers does not mean you are addicted to cheeseburgers... it means you like cheeseburgers more than you want to stop eating them...

it is an excuse mentality and is everywhere in this society...

[LJB]

1 minute ago, Mike Parrish said:

I'd compare pot to caffeine in terms of addiction persistence.

Unpleasant to stop using, but nowhere near strong opiates.
Not in the same universe.

caffeine is actually physically addictive...

[Mike Parrish]

https://nida.nih.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-addictive

https://www.addictioncenter.com/stimulants/caffeine/

 

Compare and contrast.

[LJB]

caffeine can cause a mild physical dependency...

marijuana does not have any physically addictive properties...

that is just the reality...

all the "safe speak" in the world will not change that...

[LJB]

i can feel this is just going to delve further into semantics territory and i really do not have any real desire to continue down that path...

JO was silly...

he did not need to get high at trials...

he did...

that's on him...

personally i have mixed feelings on whether or not cannabis should be tested for at all... most professional leagues have it written in their CBA agreements to absolutely not test for marijuana and for what i perceive as a very legitimate reason...

if all sports went in that direction it would not bother me in the least...

[mspart]

2 minutes ago, LJB said:

i can feel this is just going to delve further into semantics territory and i really do not have any real desire to continue down that path...

JO was silly...

he did not need to get high at trials...

he did...

that's on him...

personally i have mixed feelings on whether or not cannabis should be tested for at all... most professional leagues have it written in their CBA agreements to absolutely not test for marijuana and for what i perceive as a very legitimate reason...

if all sports went in that direction it would not bother me in the least...

Or he did it because he has dependence on it.   that is on him, just like being addicted to anything is on the individual. 

You both can debate how powerful of an addiction it might be, but pot can cause dependence which is addiction which I demonstrated above.   This all started with Oliver being censured for pot again.   He can't quit it appears.   So I suggested he either doesn't care or is addicted.   If he is addicted, he feels he can't quit.   Or if he is addicted, he doesn't really care.   Take your pick.   But to use prior to a tourney means something.   It is not meaningless. 

Essentially what you are saying is I shouldn't believe CDC or NIDA.   They both say the same thing as I demonstrated.   Am I to believe you or CDC and NIDA in the realm of addiction and effects of pot?  My gut tells me to go with CDC and NIDA.   Sorry guys. 

mspart

[LJB]

1 minute ago, mspart said:

Or he did it because he has dependence on it.   that is on him, just like being addicted to anything is on the individual. 

You both can debate how powerful of an addiction it might be, but pot can cause dependence which is addiction which I demonstrated above.   This all started with Oliver being censured for pot again.   He can't quit it appears.   So I suggested he either doesn't care or is addicted.   If he is addicted, he feels he can't quit.   Or if he is addicted, he doesn't really care.   Take your pick.   But to use prior to a tourney means something.   It is not meaningless. 

Essentially what you are saying is I shouldn't believe CDC or NIDA.   They both say the same thing as I demonstrated.   Am I to believe you or CDC and NIDA in the realm of addiction and effects of pot?  My gut tells me to go with CDC and NIDA.   Sorry guys. 

mspart

JO popped for an amphetamine the first time...

as to the rest...

again...

whatever...

i could go into a big diatribe as to why the language has changed over time and the forces behind that, but, what's the point?

as long as we have our "safe speak" and personal accountability is always on a sliding scale then i guess some are happy...

[bnwtwg]

Weed is not addictive. However, the desire to feel non-sober can be addictive.

JO should not be suspended for smoking weed. If anything, it harmed his performance. That’s on him and was his choice. I also support that these are the rules of WADA and though outdated, they are still the rules that everyone knows.

Anyways, what exactly did Chamizo pop for? I have to think it was something less fun than the devil’s lettuce…

[LJB]

5 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

Weed is not addictive. However, the desire to feel non-sober can be addictive.

JO should not be suspended for smoking weed. If anything, it harmed his performance. That’s on him and was his choice. I also support that these are the rules of WADA and though outdated, they are still the rules that everyone knows.

Anyways, what exactly did Chamizo pop for? I have to think it was something less fun than the devil’s lettuce…

3 months is the shortest suspension i have ever personally heard of...

i did not even know 3 months was an option for suspension...

clearly he was able to show in some fashion that he did not "knowingly" take something...

[bnwtwg]

3 hours ago, LJB said:

3 months is the shortest suspension i have ever personally heard of...

i did not even know 3 months was an option for suspension...

clearly he was able to show in some fashion that he did not "knowingly" take something...

"I didn't know what was in the brownie! But my scrambling IQ was higher than me!"

[LJB]

11 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

"I didn't know what was in the brownie! But my scrambling IQ was higher than me!"

i like brownies...

[Mike Parrish]

4 hours ago, LJB said:

3 months is the shortest suspension i have ever personally heard of...

i did not even know 3 months was an option for suspension...

clearly he was able to show in some fashion that he did not "knowingly" take something...

From USADA, there are a few 1 month suspensions.

Quote

Alvis, Juancamilo Ronderos	Mixed Martial Arts	Cocaine	1-Month Suspension	07/29/2021
*Name Removed	Karate	Pseudoephedrine	1-Month Suspension - Loss of Results
*Name Removed	Karate	Ephedrine	1-Month Suspension - Loss of Results
*Name Removed	Cycling	Ephedrine	1-Month Suspension - Loss of Results
Witte, Keiser	Weightlifting	Cannabinoids	1-Month Suspension; Loss of Results	02/24/2023
Palmer, Ahje	Weightlifting	Cannabinoids	1-Month Suspension; Loss of Results	03/11/2022
Richardson, Sha'Carri	Track and Field	Cannabinoids	1-Month Suspension; Loss of Results	07/02/2021
Montgomery, Kahmari	Track and Field	Cannabinoids	1-Month Suspension; Loss of Results	06/03/2021
Jackson, Tate	Swimming	Cannabinoids	1-Month Suspension; Loss of Results	04/29/2021

Here are the 3 months suspensions in Wrestling
 

Quote

*Name Removed    Wrestling    Cannabinoids    3-Month Suspension with 3-Month Deferral - Loss of Results
*Name Removed    Wrestling    Metoprolol    3-Month Suspension with 3-Month Deferral - Loss of Results
Lee, Stephany    Wrestling    Cannabinoids    3-Month Suspension with 3-Month Deferral - Loss of Results 05/13/2009

They're rare.
I suspect the two with Name Removed are the oldest.

[Nailbender]

 

 

[scourge165]

14 hours ago, Mike Parrish said:

I'd compare pot to caffeine in terms of addiction persistence.

Unpleasant to stop using, but nowhere near strong opiates.
Not in the same universe.

Yeah...comparing it to opioids and Fentanyl is just WILD.

[scourge165]

14 hours ago, bnwtwg said:

Weed is not addictive. However, the desire to feel non-sober can be addictive.

JO should not be suspended for smoking weed. If anything, it harmed his performance. That’s on him and was his choice. I also support that these are the rules of WADA and though outdated, they are still the rules that everyone knows.

Anyways, what exactly did Chamizo pop for? I have to think it was something less fun than the devil’s lettuce…

Why do you HAVE to think that? He got a 3 month suspension.

[LJB]

9 hours ago, Mike Parrish said:

From USADA, there are a few 1 month suspensions.

Here are the 3 months suspensions in Wrestling
 

They're rare.
I suspect the two with Name Removed are the oldest.

i am sure there is logical rational behind a one month suspension...

just kinda hard to see it from my perspective...

[Bigbrog]

16 hours ago, LJB said:

absolutely not... 

opiates are actually physically addictive...

marijuana is not physically addictive...

just because you are obese and weak and don't want to stop eating cheeseburgers does not mean you are addicted to cheeseburgers... it means you like cheeseburgers more than you want to stop eating them...

it is an excuse mentality and is everywhere in this society...

Will you please quit using me as an example to make a point...hurts my feelings.

[LJB]

4 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

Will you please quit using me as an example to make a point...hurts my feelings.

apologies for the fat shaming, brother...

i like cheeseburgers as well...

in fact, i am having some regrets not heading to tulsa with the chums where i could have introduced them to Ron's...

sausage cheeseburgers that you eat with a fork because no one wants that much grease on their hands...

you can even throw some chilli on that b!tch...

[Bigbrog]

10 minutes ago, LJB said:

apologies for the fat shaming, brother...

i like cheeseburgers as well...

in fact, i am having some regrets not heading to tulsa with the chums where i could have introduced them to Ron's...

sausage cheeseburgers that you eat with a fork because no one wants that much grease on their hands...

you can even throw some chilli on that b!tch...

Oh man...sounds amazing!  I am actually on week 3 of Keto to help get rid of these lbs...and actually could probably eat those sausage cheeseburgers...and then throw some chili on it....HEAD...EXPLODE...LOL